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1879
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-26-2018
02:45 UT
~
John Carr writes:

> I'm working on a Paratime novel (the one that explains what
> happened to Verkan and Dalla at the end of "Down Styphon!")

Very much looking forward to this, by the way. ;)

> 1.) I assume, from the fact that the Paratime Police are able to
> limit unrestricted Paratime travel to non-police First Level
> inhabitants, that the Paratime Police conveyors do not have a
> governor, that is, are not restricted.

I think Jon raises some interesting points about how the Paratime Police might accomplish these restrictions: whether they do it technologically (e.g. via "governors" in individual conveyors) or through regulatory regimes such as "licenses." Unfortunately, we can't tell from "Temple Trouble" which it might be because both out-time companies have "franchises"--one for uranium, one for oil--on that time-line and so are both "authorized" to be there.

> How else could they travel to un-surveyed time-lines otherwise,
> such as their search for Kalvan throughout Aryan-Transpacific,
> Styphon's House Subsector?

There's clear indication they travel to "un-surveyed" time-lines but it's not clear to me that anyone ever travels to an _undiscovered_ time-line.

Let me see if I can explain what I mean. We know that as a conveyor is traveling through a given time-line that time-line is briefly visible and potentially even "visitable" in the fashion by which Calvin Morrison ends up in Hostigos. So while a conveyor might travel through an "un-surveyed" time-line like those around the one where Morrison ended up these are still "discovered" time-lines (that may even have been "catalogued" through automated means which are able to distinguish each time-line as a conveyor travels trough it, even if they're being traversed too quickly for humans to distinguish them).

So, those other Styphon's House Subsector time-lines might be "un-surveyed" but they may very well have been identified and "catalogued" previously.

Still, this begs the question of how the Paratimers travel into genuinely "new" time-lines (which they had to do, at some early point, even of it's possibly an unlikely occurrence during Verkan Vall's tenure as a Paracop).

> We know from "Temple Trouble" that outtimers are restricted
> in where they can travel. I assumed that the Paratime Police
> Routing Department provides the companies with a route to
> and from the exploited time-lines. One of the Paratime Police's
> jobs is to keep outtimers from straying from their designated
> time-lines.

Yep. It remains to be determined whether they accomplish this technologically or through regulation (and enforcement). I don't recall any evidence one way or the other (but this wouldn't be the first thing I've overlooked in Beam's work). My vote is via regulation both because it sets up more interesting dramatic possibilities and because, practically, a technological restriction can be defeated relatively easily with sufficient funds and effort (e.g. just hire a former conveyor governor technician who's fallen down on his luck--or is mad at his old boss).

> 2.) The big question is how do the Paratime Police find or travel
> to these "new" time-lines? What mechanism do their conveyors
> use or have that the commercian conveyors do not?

So, if we assume the prohibitions are regulatory, it may simply be a matter of launching a conveyor off into the "unknown."

But it's possible that most conveyors--civilian / commercial _and_ Police--aren't even able to do this because there is no "Setting 11," no way to activate the controls in a fashion that would take the conveyor "beyond" known time-lines. Ordinarily, few folks (try to) do this, partly because it's "prohibited" and partly because there's plenty to exploit among the "known time-lines." That uranium franchise in Temple Trouble is _centuries_ old. These are not nimble commercial enterprises intent upon finding new opportunities. When they're looking to "grow the business" they look to do it at the expense of a competitor working in established time-lines.

It's sort of like why space travel has faltered in the "real universe." There's no money that can be made in orbit, or on the moon, or on Mars or Venus, that can't more easily be made somewhere right here on Earth. (I'm talking about making money doing something, not merely doing something that can only be done in space.) The same premise holds for the First Level civilization and "Known Paratime." There are already plenty of "discovered" but as yet "un-surveyed" time-lines so why bother looking for new ones?

Furthermore, First Level civilization is stagnant and parasitic. There are no First Level para-explorers looking to go "where no one has gone before."

> Certainly, Piper had them traveling all over Paratime, but
> omitted mentioning how? Or did I miss it?

I don't recall him having any Paratimers travel to "un-discovered" or uncatalogued regions of Paratime. They were, instead, ingestigating previously "un-surveyed" time-lines which were nevertheless already known to exist. (If we think about the way those "short numeral" time-line designation codes allow folks like Verkan and Tortha to get a general sense of where a time-line is located we can assume that there is a sort of "taxonomy" of designations which allows them to identify time-lines they have "discovered" but haven't visited.)

Presumably it's possible to build an "exploration conveyor" that is able to seek out new time-lines but for most conveyors, Police or civilian / commercial, this is simply an unnecessary function. The destination controls can be set for any time-line "in the catalogue" but don't have the ability to choose destinations which aren't "catalogued." (Sort of like trying to put "outer space" coordinates into the auto-pilot latitude-longitude selector on a commercial jet inertial guidance system. "Co-pilot, come to 201 mark 15. . . .")

Bottom line is that "boldly going where no one has gone before" is a specialized--and possibly obsolete or archaic--activity for First Level civilization, beyond the general purview of the Paratime Police.

>3.) Which brings up another question, what "drive" or "force"
> is used to propel the conveyors from Home Time Line to other
> levels and sectors?

This is a whole other can of para-worms! I'm always confused by those "loose wires" on the automated surveillance "balls." What in the heck were those for? Were they transmitting _power_ to some onboard battery or were they transmitting some sort of "initiation" signal to a primitive onboard computer that could only initiate the "boomerang" return sequence? I could never figure out a purpose that required the external signal--or power--in the first place. (If it's a signal why not simply build in a switch, after having "programmed" the mission details in advance?)

The only thing that even makes any kind of sense is that they are activating some sort of "wind (or "charge")-up power" device. The power from the wires transfers power to the ball which is stored mechanically / electrically in some sort of gyroscope-battery-thingy that runs down after a bit and the ball returns. But that's still ridiculous from the standpoint of the full-size conveyors which--however they're powered--don't require those wires.

(And let's not say it has something to do with the size. The Paratimers mention time-lines which have the "nuclear-electric conversion" technology which is ubiquitous throughout Beam's Terro-human Future History yarns so why not use a small one of those?)

Bottom line is, I don't think we get much at all from Beam about how the conveyor's--or the "boomerang" balls--are powered. Jon's "right hand rule" about the transposition field dynamics is as good as anything else we have (and is pretty clever, you have to admit). It might be called the "Crocker Effect." ;)

Down Styphon!

David
--
"Why, you--You parapeeper!" -- Morvan Kara (H. Beam Piper), "Police Operation"
~
1878
David SoobyPerson was signed in when posted
09-26-2018
02:17 UT
Jon Crocker said:

> Finding new timelines is another decision - is it a matter of "tuning the dial"
> to the right settings to take you outtime? Or does each new timeline have to be
> plotted by the supercomputers down in the secure vaults underneath the Paratime
> Commission Building?

I submit it's merely a matter of setting dials.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When he [Verkan Vall] was alone, he went to the coffer, an almost featureless rectangular block without visible lock or hinges...

Inside were four globes of gleaming coppery mesh, a few instruments with dials and knobs...

..."I will find a location for an antigrav conveyer to land, somewhere in the woods near Hostigos Town; when I do, I will send a message-ball through from there."

Then he replaced the mouthpiece, set the timer for the transposition-field generator, and switched on the antigrav. Carrying the ball to an open window, he tossed it outside, and then looked up as it vanished in the night. After a few seconds, high above, there was an instant's flash among the many visible stars. It looked like a meteor; a Hostigi, seeing it, would have made a wish.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--LORD KALVAN OF OTHERWHEN, ch. 6, pp. 61, 66


Clearly this describes use of a "message-ball"; it seems likely that a "boomerang-ball" is similar in function and in appearance. Presumably the boomerang-balls are only used for high-altitude aerial surveys; close-up surveys are apparently made in person by explorers or police.

It's possible to build a conveyor which is locked to shuttling back and forth between two timelines:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
...found out which was their conveyer. It was a fixed-destination shuttler, operative only between Home Time Line and Police Terminal, from which most of the Paratime Police operations were routed.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--"Time Crime", PARATIME p. 166


But I doubt most crosstime traders use fixed-destination conveyers. It would be like buying a truck which can only travel between two warehouses. For such restricted use vehicles, it seems you'd have to physically replace the pre-set control mechanism for another one, to change the route it traveled. While the Paratime Police might like such restrictions on civilians, the logistical problem that would create for trading companies seems like too much of a burden.

~~~~~~~~~~~
David Sooby
1877
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-25-2018
03:16 UT
~
Jon Crocker wrote:

> I just bought one ticket for each. Fingers crossed!

Thanks for participating and good luck!

> I was leafing through some of the posts, and had a look at
> "John Espley's Annotated Piper Bibliography" mentioned in
> post 1860 - sure enough, in the writeup of Four Day Planet
> it calls it the 'weakest'. Of course, it also states the story
> is about labour trouble on the planet Fenris, which I'd say
> was a bit of a miss.

Yeah, that part leaves me wondering if he didn't read what he dismisses as a "juvenile" at all.

Interesting tidbit here. I'd described in that post the mysterious footnote mentioning a personal letter from William Tuning. I've since found the actual reference. It's attached to the "projected" new Ace edition of ~Crisis in 2140~ ("Book "B02b") on page 173. I don't believe Ace ever reissued ~Crisis~ but it's interesting to see that Tuning seemed to have known to mention this. Also interesting is the quote from Tuning in the footnote which suggests he was working for Ace on, besides ~Fuzzy Bones~, "some edited collections of the shorter material, gathered together with annotative information." Presumably, this became the Piper anthologies edited by John Carr.

> This raised the question - what story of Piper's is the
> weakest? I haven't read Null-ABC yet, and I've asked
> here if I should bother to try to track down a copy, and
> the consensus was 'no'.

Well, I'm already on record as not being a fan of ~Null-ABC~. It's only redeeming value is that it keeps ~Lone Star Planet~ from being my least-favorite novel. (Others' mileage may vary, of course.)

For me, Beam's weakest work falls among his non-Terro-human Future History and non-Paratime yarns. The Hartley yarn "Day of the Moron" would fall "low" here, not because I don't like the politics (though I don't) but because the "lazy union workers" who absent-mindedly commit catastrophic sabotage is a too simplistic plot device. I prefer my antagonists to have some agency. . . .

Even though I enjoyed it--like popcorn--"Operation R.S.V.P." is "low" on my list too. The basic premise, that the "Ameer of Afghanistan" is able to completely out-smart two imagined Commie superpowers in a futuristic version of "The Great Game," stretches my "willing suspension of belief" beyond the limit.

"Hunter Patrol," co-authored with McGuire, is another "low" one. It's a complex story that I've found too difficult to understand. It also lacks a protagonist, a character that can be identified with positively. It's a dark yarn that isn't worth the effort to make sense of, in my view.

> The flip side is, there are many contenders for 'best', and
> not even the absolute best writer can write their best work
> all the time.

"The Mercenaries" is far and away my favorite short yarn among Beam's "other works" (and might be my all-around favorite). "The Return" is a pretty good post-apocalypse yarn too, even though I'm not a particular fan of . . . the fictional character which inspired it. "Time and Time Again" is also just a very well-written story with a wonderful relationship between Allan Hartley and his dad.

"The Keeper" is my favorite Terro-human Future History yarn. (Raud the Keeper seems the most Piper-like of Beam's protagonists, even if Jack Holloway is the "optimistic" version of Beam.) If we take that one off the table because it's so far into the Terro-human future then "Oomphel in the Sky" would be my next favorite. It's a well-crafted yarn with a wonderful portrayal of the alien Kwanns (and does a good job of rehabilitating Edith Shaw without making her a cliche').

It's tough to choose a "best" Paratime yarn because they're all pretty good. Putting aside the Kalvan novelets, "Time Crime" is my favorite because it gives the best glimpse of First Level civilization. "Last Enemy" though is a close second because the Akor-Neb civilization is one of the most well-done, creatively-imagined "alternate history" societies ever (even though I don't buy the reincarnation idea). This was the yarn that told us Beam was doing something much grander with his Paratime idea than merely trying to rewrite the Civil War.

Well, there's my two bits--worth exactly what you paid for 'em.

Cheers,

David
--
"Do you know which books to study, and which ones not to bother with? Or which ones to read first, so that what you read in the others will be comprehensible to you? That's what they'll give you [at university]. The tools, which you don't have now, for educating yourself." - Bish Ware (H. Beam Piper), ~Four-Day Planet~
~
1876
Jon CrockerPerson was signed in when posted
09-25-2018
00:43 UT
You'd have to decide if the conveyors are physically governed with lockouts and governors, or the owners have to show a licence. At the end of Temple Trouble, the big reveal is the other syndicate was trying to get a franchise away from the current holder - maybe the conveyors are so expensive that its the owner's responsibility to keep them on the timelines they're supposed to be. After all, if they're sight-seeing on the other timeline, they're not hauling goods from where they were supposed to be.

If there were lockouts or governors, would the bad guys in Temple Trouble have been able to get to that target timeline?

After all, if lots of people are packing sigma-ray needlers, as per Vall's conversation with the rocket pilot in Police Operation, I don't think they'd care where one-off conveyor visits would go.

On the other hand, that could be a recurring theme - they implement the New Unbeatable Lockout system, it works for a while and then someone exploits a weakness, and those times are the busy periods for the paracops. Then, with the lockouts down, they have to rely on the licences and franchises, and as long as you have the paperwork to show you're approved to bring in oranges, you're okay. Too many oranges, you better show Bumper Crop Certification Form X99-7/J, and they're going to take a close look at your 'black box' recorders. Then the pendulum swings again with the release of the Even More Unbreakable Lockout system.

Lots of options there.

Finding new timelines is another decision - is it a matter of "tuning the dial" to the right settings to take you outtime? Or does each new timeline have to be plotted by the supercomputers down in the secure vaults underneath the Paratime Commission Building?

I like the "tune the dial" approach myself - not every single setting gets you to a new timeline, so if you just change the red vernier from x.32 to x.33 you end up at the same place. There's lots you could decide there, like how they use the 'photographic auto-return balls' from Time Crime as a first survey - if they don't come back, scratch that setting off the 'approved' list so no one dies trying to get there. If you set the conveyor wrong enough, well, there's another name for that monument Vall also mentioned to that rocket pilot.

The 'drive force' - there is the 'right hand rule' in physics for finding the direction of a magnetic field set up by a current moving in a straight wire. Similarly, when you activate the Ghaldron-Hesthor field generator at exceptionally high energy levels, and channel that energy through a mesh of silver-irridium alloy, it exerts a force on the conveyor that takes it to the lateral time lines. If you set the controls from A to B, you go out from home time line, B to A takes you towards it. Or you could make it more complicated than that, that sounds too much like 'reversing the polarity'.

It only happens at very high energy levels, else they would have noticed some strange effects at those big particle accelerators they have around Fourth Level Europo-American.

It took a long time to work out the details, but now with the main field coil and the flux boosters for directional control, you can exactly determine your direction and attitude and transit directly to your desired timeline.
1875
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-24-2018
03:25 UT
~
[John Carr askes me to post the following.]

Hi Friends,

I'm working on a Paratime novel (the one that explains what happened to Verkan and Dalla at the end of "Down Styphon!") and I ran into some interesting questions:

1.) I assume, from the fact that the Paratime Police are able to limit unrestricted Paratime travel to non-police First Level inhabitants, that the Paratime Police conveyors do not have a governor, that is, are not restricted. How else could they travel to un-surveyed time-lines otherwise, such as their search for Kalvan throughout Aryan-Transpacific, Styphon's House Subsector?

We know from "Temple Trouble" that outtimers are restricted in where they can travel. I assumed that the Paratime Police Routing Department provides the companies with a route to and from the exploited time-lines. One of the Paratime Police's jobs is to keep outtimers from straying from their designated time-lines.

2.) The big question is how do the Paratime Police find or travel to these "new" time-lines? What mechanism do their conveyors use or have that the commercian conveyors do not? Certainly, Piper had them traveling all over Paratime, but omitted mentioning how? Or did I miss it?

3.) Which brings up another question, what "drive" or "force" is used to propel the conveyors from Home Time Line to other levels and sectors?

John Carr
~
1874
jimmyjoejanglesPerson was signed in when posted
09-24-2018
03:01 UT
I think its hard to miss that Null-Abc was right on. HE's talking about how kids will mostly speak in emojis and slang and not really use our language. He basically is describing our society where you get a "Quick STart Guide" that is all pictograms instead of an instruction manual. The descriptions of the schools are pretty accurate for some places when I was in High School. I think its a bit fun and a bit camp and am pretty sure that is was a collab which will always bring up the goofiness. I'm all about the audiobooks and it is available on Librivox, so check it out there for sure.
1873
Jon CrockerPerson was signed in when posted
09-24-2018
00:58 UT
I just bought one ticket for each. Fingers crossed! Thanks for hosting the draw, David.

I was leafing through some of the posts, and had a look at "John Espley's Annotated Piper Bibliography" mentioned in post 1860 - sure enough, in the writeup of Four Day Planet it calls it the 'weakest'. Of course, it also states the story is about labour trouble on the planet Fenris, which I'd say was a bit of a miss.

This raised the question - what story of Piper's is the weakest? I haven't read Null-ABC yet, and I've asked here if I should bother to try to track down a copy, and the consensus was 'no'.

The flip side is, there are many contenders for 'best', and not even the absolute best writer can write their best work all the time.
1872
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-21-2018
00:39 UT
~
10th Anniversary Celebration!

Zarthani'net Piper Mailing List (and Discussion Forum) will celebrate its 10th anniversary on October 4, 2018:

https://www.quicktopic.com/42/H/tnfVKeAH3s4T/p0001.0001

In celebration of this anniversary Zarthani.net is holding a fundraising "virtual raffle." One each of the 1975 Garland hardcover editions of ~Space Viking~ and ~Lord Kalvan of Otherwhen~ will be given away as raffle "prizes." These hardover facisimiles of the respective original Ace paperback editions are both used books in very good condition.

Virtual raffle "tickets" are US$10 each, submitted via PayPal using the two buttons here:

http://www.zarthani.net/anniversary.htm

You can purchase as many "tickets" as you want. The raffle "drawings" will be held on or shortly after October 25, 2018, so buy your raffle tickets now!

Cheers,

David

P.S. Please share this message with any Piper fans who might be interested in participating in the raffle. If someone here could also "cross-post" this message on the Yahoo Piper list that would be much appreciated.
--
"Oh, my people had many gods. There was Conformity, and Authority, and Expense Account, and Opinion. And there was Status, whose symbols were many, and who rode in the great chariot Cadillac, which was almost a god itself. And there was Atom-bomb, the dread destroyer, who would some day come to end the world. None were very good gods, and I worshiped none of them.” - Calvin Morrison (H. Beam Piper), ~Lord Kalvan of Otherwhen~
~
1871
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-13-2018
02:41 UT
~
Jon Crocker wrote:

> One thing I did notice on a recent re-read of Lone Star Planet,
> where Ambassador Silk was getting to the barbecue - "The
> cacophony... ...was as bad as New Year's Eve in Manhattan
> or Nairobi or New Moscow, on Terra."
>
> Part of me wondered, what happened to Old Moscow? And
> is Manhattan just the borough of New York, or was there
> renaming there, too?

It's difficult to know because ~Lone Star Planet~ is a stand alone work. We know there was a "Fourth World--or First Interplanetary--War" (which presumes a Third World War, and perhaps at least one more Interplanetary War) but we don't know much about these conflicts. We can make assumptions about them using what Beam told us about the World Wars in the Terro-human Future History and in the Hartley yarns but we're just guessing at that point.

Not hard to imagine, given the era Beam was writing in, that "Old Moscow" didn't survive those world wars. The interesting thing here is that "New Moscow" seems to have become a major city in the Solar League.

I'm guessing Manhattan is still just Manhattan, with the New Year's Eve celebration there being a cultural marker that Beam would expect his American readers to recognize. That assumption, of course, tells us a bit about what happened in those world wars too.

Cheers,

David
--
"You know how atomic energy was first used? There was an ancient nation, upon the ruins of whose cities we have built our own, which was famed for its idealistic humanitarianism. Yet that nation, treacherously attacked, created the first atomic bombs in self defense, and used them." - Kradzy Zago (H. Beam Piper), "Flight from Tomorrow"
~
1870
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-13-2018
02:24 UT
~
Jon Crocker wrote:

> I agree that "technical ability" would be a better descriptor
> than 'culture'. Unless he's making the point that technology
> is so interwoven with society?

I'm guessing the first part. The only insight we get is into Marduk and there doesn't seem to be anything particularly salient about technology in the culture there.

> I don't know how uniform any 'federation culture' would be,

This is a good point. It does seem though that there weren't any monarchies among the "Federation Member Republics." There may have been some which were more autocratic than democratic--as long as they weren't expansionist, and thereby threatening to the Federation's interstellar order--but the petty government corruption in a place Poictesme--or early Venus, for that matter--seems rather far removed from the "Planetary Nationalist" dictatorship of Viking era Aton.

Point is, there does seem to be _some_ "culture" in the Federation and it's different from what we see on Marduk and hear about on Aton.

The interesting thing here is the "space" this leaves for the "cultures" on other Viking era "civilized worlds" like Odin, Baldur and Osiris. Lots of room for variety there, given the examples of Marduk and Aton. One would guess, given the origins of the (first) Galactic Empire on Marduk and then Odin, that Odin is also a monarchy. But the other "civilized planets"? Who knows?

Cheers,

David
--
"There aren't a dozen and a half planets in the Old Federation that still have hyperdrive, and they're all civilized." - Otto Harkaman (H. Beam Piper), ~Space Viking~
~
1869
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-13-2018
02:09 UT
~
Jim Broshot wrote:

> https://www.fadedpage.com/showbook.php?pid=20180890

Thanks for this, Jim. Good to see Greg Weeks (along with some friends) is still doing the rest of us Piper fans this service.

Cheers,

David
--
"Why Walt Disney bought the movie rights to ['Rebel Raider'], I've never figured out. Will Colonel Mosby be played by Mickey Mouse, and General Phil Sheridan by Donald Duck? It's baffling. However, I was glad to get the check." -- H. Beam Piper, The Pennsy interview, 1953
~
1868
Jon CrockerPerson was signed in when posted
09-13-2018
01:34 UT
You're probably okay right now if you're tapped for downloading from the Canadian site. Or if you live in, say, Arizona. If you live where it snows in the US, and it's dead of winter, well...

I agree that "technical ability" would be a better descriptor than 'culture'. Unless he's making the point that technology is so interwoven with society? I don't know how uniform any 'federation culture' would be, after all most people here-and-now can spot the differences between UK and US and Australian culture. Maybe Canadian. Probably New Zealand too. And that's just the anglosphere. Similar differences in the spanish-speaking world, too.

It's interesting the things you pick up on re-reads. One thing I did notice on a recent re-read of Lone Star Planet, where Ambassador Silk was getting to the barbecue - "The cacophony... ...was as bad as New Year's Eve in Manhattan or Nairobi or New Moscow, on Terra."

Part of me wondered, what happened to Old Moscow? And is Manhattan just the borough of New York, or was there renaming there, too?
1867
Jim BroshotPerson was signed in when posted
09-12-2018
14:39 UT
Another Piper work has been posted on the Canadian Faded Page site.

Fuzzy Sapiens

https://www.fadedpage.com/showbook.php?pid=20180890

Again note warnings about downloading if you are not a Canadian. :)

Jim Broshot
1866
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
09-09-2018
16:39 UT
~
The culture of the Terran Federation?

Here's how Beam introduces Gilgamesh in ~Space Viking~:

"Gilgamesh was rated, with reservations, as a civilized planet though not on a level with Odin or Isis or Baldur or Marduk or Aton or any of the other worlds which had maintained the culture of the Terran Federation uninterruptedly."

Beam's conception of "the culture of the Terran Federation" seems to be focused on technological capability. He goes on immediately to write, "Perhaps Gilgamesh deserved more credit; its people had undergone two centuries of darkness and pulled themselves out of it by their bootstraps. They had recovered all the old techniques, up to and including the hyperdrive."

This emphasis upon technological capability seems to fit with Marduk being described as having "maintained the culture of the Terran Federation" because Marduk, a constitutional monarchy, seems rather different "culturally" from the bureaucratic, nominally-representative democracy which characterized the Terran Federation.

Furthermore, Aton, with a "Planetary Nationalist" government described explicitly as a dictatorship, is also considered to have "maintained the culture of the Terran Federation." Yet, putting aside the views of some radical Alliance sympathizers, the Federation could hardly have been considered a dictatorship.

If Beam--or his editors--had instead written "worlds which had maintained the _technological_capability_ of the Terran Federation uninterruptedly" would it have captured more accurately what he actually meant? Would such a description have omitted anything Beam intended when he wrote "the culture of the Terran Federation"?

Cheers,

David
--
". . . in one of the big hollow buildings that had stood since Khepera had been a Member Republic of the Terran Federation." - Lucas Trask (H. Beam Piper), ~Space Viking~
~
1865
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
08-18-2018
03:58 UT
~
From the Archives: Islamic Caliphate (and Kaliphate) II

Below, another long message to the old PIPER-L mailing list from back in September 2001 (nine days before the fateful day that month):

---

Subject: The Islamic Caliphate
From: John Anderson
Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2001 14:16:45 -0400

Dear fellow Piper aficionados--

As the topic has been brought up, it might be a good time to reveal some of my research. For the past year, I have been working on ‘A Study of Piper’s WWIII’, though it also includes projections for WWIV and even the Mars-Venus Revolt. It’s a fairly large paper, and not quite done (I only have a few more sections to flesh out, though it will still need to be rewritten), but I believe I have some answers as to how the nuclear exchange proceeds, who survives the war to fight in WWIV, and what steps Alan Hartley thought needed to be taken ‘to stop a world war’ (I agree the Hartleys could be in the THFH). John Carr has seen the sections in serial fashion, and has generously given me plenty of positive feedback. I can start posting the sections this week (a few at a time), either beginning with ‘The Red-Menaced Middle-East’ or ‘The First Terran Federation’ sections ‘Corporate State’ and 'WWIII Survivors’. As a preliminary, here are my answers to points Steve has posted previously, which are in ‘The Islamic Caliphate’ sections of my paper. Since he’s a real historian, I will state that my slightly variegated background includes a stint as a Research Scientist for a world leader in sensor technology. I have worked on a variety of government and environmental projects using satellite imagery and Geographic Information Systems. My degree is in geography, which is closely linked with history, another longtime love of mine. So I’m no historian, but pretty good at research.
  
1. Turkey
My belief is that Turkey is a member of the Caliphate, or at the very least, the discussions between Khalid and the President of Turkey are concerning its joining that organization. (See ‘North Africa’ below for my explanation of the IC’s origin and extent.) Turkey is a pro-Western country, and Khalid is pro-Western as well, so they are likely friends. Also, Turkey is one of the most powerful Moslem countries, so its leader would be a logical person for Khalid to confer with closely; especially if it is in the IC, since Turkish support in the Parliament would be politically important. (The discussions with the Turkish President could then be about coordinating their positions on some question about to be debated in the Parliament.) Thus, I come to the opposite conclusions as Steve apparently does as to Turkey’s later actions. Tallal is probably also pro-Western, because he was educated in England, and he will have known the assassination of his father and destabilization of his country were Eastern-inspired. The rebellions in Damascus and elsewhere are presumably anti-Tallal and anti-Western. Turkey’s army goes on the march ‘to restore order’, therefore they are probably aiding Tallal put down the insurrections. The annexation of Syria and Lebanon certainly show the Turks are taking opportunistic advantage of the situation to reconquer these formerly Ottoman territories, but this may actually be the price Tallal must pay for their support. Tallal brings the Caliphate into the TF just before WWIII, which suggests he has gained the upper hand over the rebels, and has probably largely reunified the IC with Turkish (and other pro-Tallal elements’) help. I do agree that Khalid and Tallal are Iraqis, and the IC capital is in Basra. But I would suggest that after Khalid’s death, Tallal does not go to Iraq (or possibly Jordan) to ‘wait out the storm’. Rather, this is to secure his power-base, and rally Caliphate and international support before beginning his counterattack.

2. Afghanistan
Piper does mention the country; in ‘Operation RSVP’, the Afghan Ameer says that ‘the invasion of India’ by the USSR and China ‘would mean nothing short of the national extinction of the Kingdom of Afghanistan, and the enslavement of the Afghan people.’ (WoHBP, pg. 142) The logical deduction is that the ‘Fall of India’ to communism also involves the communizing of Afghanistan, which may support Steve’s view that it is not in the IC. As he notes, this could mean a direct ground invasion by the USSR on the way to India (which also means they invade Pakistan), and I agree that physical linkage with India is on the Soviet agenda. The Afghans would certainly put up stiff resistance; not counting the actual Soviet invasion in 1979, in the 19th Century the Afghans trounced the British a few times. Though the British repaid them in kind, the Raj was forced to be content with having Afghanistan in the British ‘sphere of influence’ (recognized as such by Russia). Piper’s Afghanistan may give the Soviets similar headaches. The country might not be a member of the IC, since I believe the ‘Fall of India’ takes place in the late 1960s/early 70s of the THFH, and becomes a major catalyst in the creation of the Caliphate in 1973. The Moslem nations can see the regional clockwise trend in the Eurasian spread of Communism (first Russia, then China, now India—the Middle East is probably next), and unite against it. And the threat would be even more immediate if the Soviets do in fact directly invade Afghanistan and Pakistan. But the Ameer and his government could flee the country when the Communists take over. If so, they would certainly take refuge in the Middle East, and could therefore participate in the creation of the Caliphate. This would make their country ‘technically’ part of the IC, giving Khalid a claim to the area.

3. Azerbaijan
I agree with those who equate the ‘Eastern-inspired uprising in Azerbaijan’ with ‘more trouble in northern Iran’. This is certainly the Iranian province the Soviets occupied after WWII. The Soviets are fomenting unrest to destabilize Iran (and by extension, the Caliphate), as a pretext to return troops to the area. This makes more sense than an independent Azerbaijan, because Beam’s USSR and Iran were probably the same as ours. In any case, I don't think Steve’s statement ‘Khalid meanwhile peels Azerbaijan away from the Soviets’ is credible. The IC cannot possibly take a bite out of a big superpower without a major war, which would probably result in the breakup of the fledgling Caliphate. It’s like saying Mexico (or better, a Latin American coalition) could take New Mexico from the US without any consequences or conflict.

4. North Africa
North Africa is also most likely part of the Caliphate. Circumstantial evidence includes the Egyptian who kills Khalid, and the ‘Ankara to Alexandria, Alexandria to Dakar’ (WoHBP, pg. 96) route Benson takes home from WWIII. But this is also because the most likely origin of the IC is the Arab League, which was set up after WWII, and includes North Africa and the Arab Middle East. I envision Khalid as the Arab League leader (they have a Secretary-General like the UN, which may be why Khalid is never called ‘Caliph’) who persuades the non-Arab nations to join with the existing membership in a new pan-Islamic organization. ‘Islamic’ Caliphate suggests the entire non-communist Moslem world, probably with aspirations on the communist-ruled Moslem areas in the Caucasus and Central Asia. This would then match the other power-blocs in ‘The Mercenaries’, which also control large regions. The Western Union contains the US/Canada, Western Europe, and Japan (possibly even Australia and New Zealand), the Ibero-American Confederation is all Latin America, and the Fourth Komintern is the entire communist bloc. A Caliphate only including the Middle Eastern nations does not ‘fit’ this system. Also, a ‘Power-Bloc Period’ of large regional groupings seems the logical intermediate step between the ‘Nation-State Era’ of previous world wars and the ‘Unified Planet’ of Piper’s later Terra. Moreover, WWIV destroys the entire Northern Hemisphere. Assuming the Caliphate survives WWIII (see ‘Israel’, below), then North Africa is destroyed in WWIV, therefore it is probably part of the IC. If Piper is thinking of history in a cyclical sense, think back to Islam’s beginnings. In the reunification of the entire Moslem world, Islam would come full circle. It is probably not too hard for Khalid to get the non-Arab nations to agree to join with the Arab ones, since these include Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Malaysia, and Indonesia, which are all ‘front line’ nations in Asia under direct threat from expansionist Communism. Most of these nations were/are members of NATO, CENTO, SEATO, and the Baghdad Pact, anti-Communist defense leagues set up by the US after WWII to ‘contain’ the Soviet Bloc. I propose that the IC is a unification of the Arab League countries with those in the Baghdad Pact; this would explain why Iraq is the ‘linchpin’ of the IC, since it was the only member of both organizations. It could also explain why Piper was vague about Afghanistan and Indonesia, as they are the only two nations belonging to neither group.

5. The Subcontinent
I agree that the Indian Communist invasion of Bangladesh is part of its strategy to rule the entire Subcontinent. It may also be to forestall a two-front war with the Caliphate, which is inevitable if Bangladesh is still part of Pakistan, but may be too an opportunistic move taking advantage of the IC’s internal unrest. The Sikhs likely leave during or directly after India’s Revolution, since revolutions always cause refugee problems. The Sikhs are in NW India, and so probably go to Pakistan; other refugees (including devout Hindus and Moslems fleeing 'godless' communism) also end up in neighboring countries, including Bangladesh, Ceylon, and Burma. Not to Nepal and Bhutan if they can help it, for with India communist, these countries are caught between Hindu-hammer and Sino-anvil; they will not long remain free. This may be part of India’s excuse to invade Bangladesh, for among the refugee camps, Indian guerilla groups probably form, and make strikes across the border. The reason India’s invasion activates the alliance systems (TF versus Eastern Axis), similar to WWI, is because this is an overt act of war, unlike the previous ‘covert’ attempts to destabilize the Caliphate. But why does the Eastern Axis strike at this time? I have an answer, which I will post another time.

6. Israel
I agree that they are probably ‘waiting out the storm’, though also being pro-Western they might lend some covert aid to Tallal and the Turks (with whom Israel has always had pretty good relations). There is also evidence Israel continues far into the future. In ‘Crisis in 2140’, Piper mentions that ‘the Arab-Israeli dispute has been finally, definitely, and satisfactorily settled. This morning’s reports from Baghdad and Tel Avivů’ (Crisis, pg. 9). It is significant that Piper does not say ‘Damascus’, ‘Amman’, or ‘Cairo’. His use of Baghdad, which is not far from Basra, suggests the Caliphate exists in that story, and thus survives WWIII, as does Israel, which remains independent of it. Contrary to ‘Crisis’, however, we can presume they both go down in WWIV.

7. Indonesia
And contrary to what has been posted, I see no reference to Indonesia being part of the Eastern Axis in ‘Hunter Patrol’. There are mentions of Hindu troops and the Hindi language, which of course means India. Beam is unclear on Indonesia’s fate, so it could go either way (unless someone can give me a direct quote from a Piper story). My own feeling is that the ‘Indonesian campaign of ’62 and ‘63’ is a successful suppression of a communist insurgency. That’s because Blake Hartley is likely President at the time (Allan says, ‘In 1960, I think we can elect you President’), and we know the Hartleys will follow strong policies. Also, the successful spread of communism in Piper’s time was almost entirely land-based. Indonesia is an archipelago; the dominance of the US Navy could interdict arms shipments to the rebels, strangling the insurgency. The Soviets would likely veto any resolution for UN action; therefore the campaign is by the US and Indonesian government, probably supported by America's SEATO allies. (The only exception to the ‘mainland expansion’ rule is Cuba, whose revolution could probably have been reversed. Though the Soviets had threatened to use their missiles if the US invaded, Kennedy knew the ‘Missile Gap’ was illusory. Had he been more courageous, Cuba would probably not be communist today. Indeed, I remember reading the Soviets were amazed that we didn’t follow up the Cuban Exiles’ invasion with a full-fledged US one, as they themselves would have done in our place.)

--John Anderson

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John's original message is available here:

https://web.archive.org/web/20080310084101...r-l&T=0&F=&S=&P=149

Like Steve Newton's previous post, John's message also sparked a wide-ranging follow-on discussion. Still seemed to be some conflation here of the "Islamic Caliphate" of the Terro-human Future History and the Islamic Kaliphate of the "Hartley yarns"--many of us were doing that back then--but interesting work nonetheless.

Cheers,

David
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"I was trying to show the results of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire after the First World War, and the partition of the Middle East into a loose collection of Arab states, and the passing of British and other European spheres of influence following the Second." - Edward Chalmers (H. Beam Piper), "The Edge of the Knife"
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1864
David "PiperFan" JohnsonPerson was signed in when posted
08-17-2018
16:17 UT
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Cheers,

David
--
Visit the H. Beam Piper Home Page: www.zarthani.net
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