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David Sloane
05-13-2012
01:55 AM ET (US)
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Hello Terri, There was a wonderful ministry that you had gone to in Long Beach. Brant was at his finest there in my opinion. Some people fall under the power of the Holy Spirit and others do not. I can recall hearing someone once say that most leaders in the church do not fall. I did, once at a Kathryn Kuhlman meeting when she had called all of the young people to come up on stage. And once when at the end of a Saturday night service Brant came down from the stage and gently touched each person in the front row where I was standing. The funny thing was several of us refused to go down and yet we did...it was the real deal. The whole front row went down. Here is a video of a Shekinah fellowship service that had appeared on TBN once: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UY_aba9bl2Y&email=comment_received&lc=OpIZSUa8bsnyEax9JZp_GdIshLX18BhJh3dsFiAlFzM&lch=email&feature=email For some reason the link is not working in here. Just copy and paste it into your browser's address box to see the YouTube video. David Edited 05-13-2012 01:58 AM
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Terri
05-13-2012
12:23 AM ET (US)
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Hello, I am new here in this thread. I was abandoned by my Mother at around 2 or 3 years of age and left in a very disfunctional family situation. Beaten and etcetera. I started listening to the radio message from Brant Baker. It was in the seventies. And he sounded wonderful. He had such a melodic and soothing voice. I used to ride my bicycle to the services on Junipero Avenue in Long Beach.I was sent up on the stage and Brant prayed for me once. I went to Bible School in Costa Mesa soon after that. Dated Dr. Martin's son while attending Bible school. And attended Shekina Fellowship once or twice with friends who went up on the stage to see if they would be "slain in the Spirit".Some were. I never could figure out why I would not fall. I asked around about Brant after that and someone said he had died. That was such a sad thing for me to comprehend. Edited 05-13-2012 12:29 AM
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David Sloane
04-28-2012
10:46 AM ET (US)
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Yes David the word "cult" has been used in critical ways way too many times. May I respectfully submit to you that there are times when the word can and does apply. The late Dr. Walter Martin cast some light on cults and semantics of word usage:
http://www.waltermartin.com/cults.html#semant
http://www.waltermartin.com/eyewit.html
Walters book "Kingdom Of The Cults" makes for a very good read.
I attended a week long series of studies by Walter at Chuck Smith's church in the early 70's. I then continued to attend his Melody Land studies. Walter was more like a law professor in his attention to details. He always backed up his claims and proved his points as if he were in a court of law.
It was so fascinating to hear someone who actually knew what he was talking about. Many non Christians used to listen to his radio programs (The Bible Answer Man) and call in with some lively debates. I know of one old communist fellow in a rest home who was an avid listener of Walter's program. This man respected Walter's work and intelligence even though he never accepted Christ.
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Dave Koerner
04-27-2012
04:15 PM ET (US)
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I generally agree with Tim - The use of "cult" in its original definition is a good corrective to the use of the term as a meaningless way to criticize. I remember when people would say in hushed and alarmed tones that Shekinah was a "cult" (rather than a true religion) as if this explained something. It explained nothing. It was just a way of castigating the "other" while ignoring one's own faults. More recently, I was treated to a diatribe from a rather batty fundamentalist going on about how Mormonism was a "cult". Pot and kettle!!
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Tim Warner
04-25-2012
04:26 PM ET (US)
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I wasn't criticizing the use of the word "cult" by the way, just passing along some information. YES, David Sloane is a remarkable servant of God and has done a wonderful job with this site as well as personally ministering to me in a way that continues to bear good fruit in my life to this day. And I have only met him online! May God Bless David immensely in the ways that he is needing at this particular point in time. He is a great brother. Incidentally, I don't think I could qualify as a cult devotee of Brant nor Shekinah Fellowship. I never knew him, although I was on the outskirts of the Shekinah Fellowship during those days. I wish though that I had been privileged to attend the services which seem so Spirit filled that I am still touched by watching the YouTube features which exist.
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Caryn LeMur
04-25-2012
03:23 PM ET (US)
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Tim: you may be correct via dictionary. Indeed, there is the 'Cult of Mary' within the Catholic church, and they are highly spoken of by many.
However, I lean towards using the word for those that (1) follow a person's teaching, and (2) cut off outside sources of counter-information from consideration. Thus, within my usage of the word, I have cultic-atheist friends and open-atheist friends; I have cultic-charismatic friends and open-charismatic friends.
By the way, what I have continued to enjoy about this blog is that this blog is not cultic. This blog has been very open to receiving and discussing counter-information. There is no cult of Brant here. We have people here that tend to believe Brant was a divine healer, prophet, prophet that fell, spiritual leader, homosexual with lover, homosexual that seduced some, pastor-teacher, great speaker, false prophet, homosexual that believed he was reversed to heterosexual, and... the list goes on. I am fascinated by this blog's ability to handle/allow so much counter-information. My congratulations to David Sloan.
Much love in Christ always and unconditionally; Caryn
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Tim Warner
04-25-2012
06:32 AM ET (US)
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Strictly speaking, and according to definition, Christianity is a cult. The word is not necessarily always a perjorative.
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Dave Koerner
04-25-2012
01:18 AM ET (US)
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Yes, "cultic" is often incendiary because of pejorative use. But I like to use it to point out the irony that underlies most acts of pointing the "cult" finger. A "cult" seems to always be what some *other* religious group is doing in contrast to the "true" religion the finger-pointer is practicing. And yet - I'm hard pressed to see what distinguishes a 'cult' from most evangelical religious practice. Seriously.
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Caryn LeMur
04-12-2012
10:38 PM ET (US)
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I would like to offer that some of our generation were strongly split: some needed a sense of great anchor, and others were more at ease with ambivalence.
- Those that need anchor tend strongly towards being of a certain position: strongly republican, strongly democratic; strongly against abuse of American Indians, strongly manifest destiny; strongly atheist, strongly believing; isolating from the non-conforming, or insisting on ‘change’ for them; and so forth. They have a sense of destination.
- But those that are more at ease with ambivalence tend to happily explore: mixing political views (or being non-political), rethinking history, trusting Christ yet open to many views, welcoming the non-conforming without change. They have a sense of journey.
I personally am therefore careful to call anyone ‘cultic’ – those that need an anchor may perceive that word as an insult. ‘Cultic’, to them, may mean irrational and non-thinking. Some atheists I know are outstanding thinkers; indeed, I’ve met some republicans that think very clearly….
I have mostly a sense of journey, and not a sense of anchor. That is one reason why I can share the love of Christ among the ex-felons, the homeless, the girls sleeping among the men, the alcoholics, and the veterans living in the woods. Today, I gave pizza out to them with gentle love, and had a good conversation with a homeless Muslim from Africa, and a woman recently out from jail. Since I have little sense/need for anchor, they simply are not threatening to my core beliefs. My relationship with Jesus is the one anchor I need – and that thread of faith is amazingly small in diameter, and yet amazingly strong.
May I offer that those that strongly need a sense of anchor have a valid approach to life. May I also offer that those that strongly need a sense of journey have a valid approach to life.
Those that tend towards anchor, praise Brant or curse him – there is no in-between. And, in their view, there should be no in-between. Those that tend towards journey will thank Brant in heaven for being part of that journey, for better or for worse, for their faith grew in the midst of green pastures and raging storm.
Much love in Christ always and unconditionally; Caryn
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eileen
04-11-2012
10:51 PM ET (US)
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Hi John,
Originally yes i am from the east coast. I have stayed in California since. How are you? What have you been doing? I sent you an e-mail. That way you have it. Thanks for responding.
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John Knowles
04-11-2012
10:35 PM ET (US)
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Hi. It's me johnknowlesjude3@hotmail.com. Love to hear from you.
How's life on the east coast. That's where you're from right?
________________________________
From: QT - eileen <qtopic-39-LLn3p9VeCH5Sp@quicktopic.com>
To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic-subs@quicktopic.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 1969 5:00 PM
Subject: Shekinah Fellowship
< replied-to message removed by QT >
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eileen
04-11-2012
09:38 PM ET (US)
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There was a gentleman posting here, John Calvin. He left Shekinah and was ministered to by Calvary Chapel. I would like to know if he is the same person who came to live at one of Calvary's communial homes? Did he live at the Maranatha House. If so then please contact me. I remember you there. I have wondered how you were.
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Hannelore
04-11-2012
12:04 PM ET (US)
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Yes the 10 cats do give me lots of laughs. 2 20 lb maine coons,who are males and in love with each other. You know that I really like the puritan works and find them to be simple bible based theology. There zeal and love for God. The reformers, were on fire for the truth of the word. I dont see it as a cult.The over zealous and emergent church,s and new truth from God churchs scare me more. You know where Gold dust and new gold teeth and gems falling from heaven is really scary stuff. No where in the bible do you hear about gems falling from the sky as from God. Anyway, I love reading the works of Spurgeon, Luther, and the reformers.
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David Sloane
04-11-2012
10:55 AM ET (US)
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Hi Dave,
I kind of agree with your statement concerning post-reformation European puritanism. Most of the people that I come across that are into it seem fanatical to me in their embracing of it. I like to keep it simple.
If I see Sandy I will say Hi for you. I last heard she was in Newport Beach. She gets around. She is very talented, her poetry is wonderful.
I have seven birds, one hugh goldfish, a Red Eared Slider , two dogs and a Plymouth Barred chicken. My African Grey likes to sit on the end table next to me and hang out while I tap away on my laptop. He is 9 months so he doesn't have much of a vocabulary yet, just a lot of squeeks and strange noises peppered with some words here and there. Very entertaining bird!
Hannelore,
I was assigned to 3 cats and three dogs during the 80's. All the cats would greet me in the driveway when I came home from work everyday. They made me feel so good and very loved. I can only imagine the joy that ten cats give.
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Dave Koerner
04-10-2012
07:35 PM ET (US)
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Hah - remember this?!! - (from Sandy) http://choir.worshipthe1.net/worship/Lyric...iles/files/b_71.pdf
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Dave Koerner
04-10-2012
06:49 PM ET (US)
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p.s. Saw some mention of Sandy H. Are you still in touch w/her David? If so, say hi for me! I always liked her - she was a hoot!
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