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Diane
05-25-2012
11:51 AM ET (US)
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Fred Day
05-25-2012
11:26 AM ET (US)
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Sam: I presume that is the unedited RAH concert, which also includes Costa's 5 piano solos. You are right, the sound quality is wonderful, crisp and clear. Clyde Smith made this available a number of years ago. Ciao.
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Fred Day
05-25-2012
11:01 AM ET (US)
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Martino: What about Joseph Schmidt?? He recorded quite a number of Neapolitan songs, most of them in Italian, a few in German. He recorded O Sole Mio in both Italian and German. I have always been fond of his interpretations. One song in particular, that I love, by Schmidt, is Buzzi-Peccia's Mal D'Amore, a lovely song. Ciao.
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Pam Latham
05-25-2012
09:55 AM ET (US)
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Sam and Patrick, unfortunately Warner Brothers Shop ( the link Sam provided) only despaches to the USA. I tested it out just in case there was a mistake, but a message popped on the screen to say delivery only in the USA. Hopefully sometime in the future it will become available worldwide, perhaps through Critics Choice like th others.
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Patrick Long To Sam
05-25-2012
08:54 AM ET (US)
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Hi Sam thank you for that info on FTFT. I have thanks to you sent an email to that link. Incidently you're probably curius as to why I want the DVD in its original form Widescreen( Cinemascope ) Well I'm a movie buff that like these old Cinemascope films in the original form that I first saw them in. Incidently do you remember years ago you were after the video of The Christopher Tape? I presume you have it by now? If you don't let me know. Once again thank you for the info.
Regards From Patrick
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Martino to Rob
05-25-2012
08:28 AM ET (US)
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I agree with you that we are all different and hear and feel things differently. I recall a conversation here once where the philosophy of "Differential Association" was discussed and applied to music. Basically, we are a product of our environment. Our values and what is important to us are framed by how and where and at what point in time we were raised and developed as adults.
For me, the use of style and words, the communication of the text through the voice, has always been important to me, especially in Italian song, and I attribute that to my background and understanding of the language and meanings. Others can be equally affected simply by the delivery and sound they hear and they certainly do not have to be Italian, as the Asian audience showed in their response to Carlo. Others are only impressed with notes. On the surface, Wunderlich sings as well as anyone with his beautiful voice but something is lacking in his Italian song style, perhaps it could be described as "warmth" or maybe better, "charm" - and the language with its colder emphasis on consonants rather than vowels does not help him bring forth this necessary ingredient. The brilliance of the Wunderlich voice comes through without question, but where is the sweetness? Gigli was described as having the sun of Italy in his throat and it was always present, especially in Italian song. The same could be said of Lanza and DiStefano. Bjorling was not Italian and yet he came close to sounding like one, especially as he gained experience and so did Richard Tucker and even Jan Peerce. This ability helped them in their interpretations of Italian songs and that genre is all we are talking about here, not opera. Wunderlich never got the chance to do much in the way of Italian singing and I'm sure he would have captured the essence of this music if he lived a bit longer and sang internationally in the music's actual native language. He had the legato as we hear in some arias but he never had much of a chance to apply it.
And in the "Granada", let's face it, the recording engineers are at least equally as impressive as Fritz. This is not how he sounded in person as the numerous live recordings we have of him show. It is Wunderlich on steroids, artificial ones at that. The dynamic range was expanded and there was added brilliance and heft. I don't know how they did it but they have this beautiful and quintessential lyric voice sounding like Mario Del Monaco in this recording! As Sam just said, a non-engineered voice can be stunning, especially one as great as Wunderlich, so why try to make it something it is not just to show it off? Wunderlich's voice never needed to be "showed off".
For me, to listen to a singer and not having the vaguest idea in my mind of what he/she is saying or trying to communicate, at least in general terms if not word for word, is unacceptable. There have been many times when that has happened of course in works I don't know and have not had time to study and with languages I am not at all familiar. In those cases I can appreciate a voice for what it is in terms of quality and sound, but I can not endorse the interpretation because I can't tell if the point the singer was trying to make was, in fact, made. This is what is necessary for me to fully appreciate a performance, although I understand that others may not need or even want to go to such extremes.
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Ed to Martino/Rob
05-25-2012
08:25 AM ET (US)
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I am familiar with Bergonzi's rendition of the Non Ti and it is quite good for a man a bit beyond his prime. As for Vergiss Mein Nicht not actually being Non Ti, IMHO I must say that my not being an Italian but Brooklyn born Irish American I may not have the genes to feel what others do I only listen to the beauty of the voice and if it moves me then fine. Rob, I think you said it best in your posst about Titanic and your grandfather. This may strike you as peculiar but even being a catholic I get moved when Al Jolson sings Kol Nidrei, it is his sense of his which beliefs comes through.
Getting back to Lanza/Fritz-I recall Lara's comment about Lanza's Granada, in this I feel Mario hits this dead on with the early recording, I think it is on one of Jeff's CDs I bought a while back. Fritz's later recording I think in '66 was off the charts with the opening high whatever it was to the finish. As for McCormack I was never too much of a fan. Growing up in an Irish house I had to spar for space (LOL) to bring in Mario who surely was the better. His Danny Boy is still the best I've heard.
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Diane
05-25-2012
07:42 AM ET (US)
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Martino: Enjoyed the Bergonzi clip. Yes, his delivery was wonderful, and I liked the way he formed the notes - not sure what you call that technically. Some really nice notes. The young tenor that I like in Il Volo is phrasing similiar, altho his voice is not yet fully mature or technically sound. I listened to Celeste Aida when he was somewhat younger - very powerful.
Rob: I may not be Italian but by this time I have a sense of the words, and certainly get the emotion. In fact I almost prefer it when I don't understand the words and just absorb the music - as you said you do with Wunderlich.
I have no idea why I'm up at 6 am. A rarity for me.
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Rob to Sam
05-25-2012
05:44 AM ET (US)
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Sam, could you give a bottom line cost, including postage and handling to Australia, please, for that Royal Albert Hall concert CD - I can easily hear the RCA CD of the edited concert tape from our library system here. Your description of the concert with asides and full audience reaction, however, sounds very tempting.
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Rob to Martino
05-25-2012
05:14 AM ET (US)
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As I wrote the previous post, I was listening to a CD of music recorded of music played on the first (and only) voyage of the Unsinkable Titanic - that sank, causing many deaths of people from many countries. My father's father worked with many others to build the hull of that huge, ill fated vessel, in Belfast, so to hear that music moves me greatly. We are, Italians, Americans, British or whoever all of the one species - all capable of being moved, to a greater or lesser degree, by music, whatever the language that may be used.
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Sam Samuelian
05-25-2012
05:05 AM ET (US)
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More Great News (actually old news but still great). For years I've listened to and loved Mario's Royal Albert Hall concert. First on LP, then on the CD. A few years ago I bought a CD made in England of the concert that was made from the master tapes but played it on a cheap portable. Yesterday I played it in our van and it BLEW ME AWAY. His voice is as crisp and clear as if he were standing right in front of you! It's like this gigantic "wall" of sound. Mario's home recordings using his newly purchased tape recorder are thrilling but they are mostly distorted to some degree--but the purity of his non-engineered voice is stunning. So now we can all hear this same purity but for a full hour!!! The CD includes some nice photos, is 65 minutes long since it includes ALL audience applause and those captivating moments when Mario says things softly, jokes with Callinicos, clears his throat, etc. I wrote an article about it years ago which is still on the home page of this site. I can get you this CD if you want one--but only if you want one to be thrilled.
Patrick: You can pre-order For the First Time from Warner Brothers Archive Shop for the June 19th release. Cost is 17.95 plus 2.50 shipping plus sales tax. It should look excellent, be in the imperative cinemascope, and have great sound.Link: http://www.wbshop.com/product/for+the+firs...urPicks&from=Search Also, I hope they haven't skipped over Seven Hills or Rome, which should have been the next logical release and would make complete the releases on DVD of all Mario's films. OH if he only could get ONE film treatment on blu ray. Not only was I blown away by RAH CD, I also was blown away by watching the new Universal "Buck Privates" in a special two disc and colorful booklet release. This is without doubt THE best quality I've ever seen on a film this old. So razor sharp you can see the fabric on coat patterns of the men, rich contrast, and sound so much better than what has been around. We started watching it late and couldn't turn it off. Great film too, much aided by fabulous Andrews Sisters classic songs like "Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy".
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Rob to Martino
05-25-2012
04:54 AM ET (US)
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Martino, please know that the following comments are written partly in jest (I am after all trying [very trying] hard always to be the class clown):
That was rather a low blow, to use the incomparable Carlo Bergonzi as an example of how best to sing 'Non ti scordar di me" - could there have been a dry eye, or a heart not overflowing with affection, in his audience on that occasion?
We who are not Italian cannot, of course, feel as Italians do; we must feel the way we we were made, in other moulds made in other countries. Yet, as a simple and witless Aussie, I am thrilled immensely by Fritz Wunderlich's splendid singing of 'Vergiss mein nicht', even though I have only the vaguest idea of what words and meanings he may use.
It's always good to see a lively and good natured discussion, and this one is warming very nicely.
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Fred Day
05-25-2012
01:23 AM ET (US)
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It is also interesting to hear Granada sung in Italian. There are only a few recordings of it in Italian, the one I recall is by Claudio Villa. Actually, Villa recorded the song in both Spanish and Italian. And both very nicely. Ciao.
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Martino to Ed
05-24-2012
11:57 PM ET (US)
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Like you, Ed, I love anything sung by Fritz Wunderlich. His voice was so good that he is on everyone's "top ten" list even if he did die at age 36 and before establishing an international career. However, being an Italian I find myself looking at this a bit differently. Frankly, cringing a bit when I hear this song sung in both the style he uses and in the German language. Nothing against Fritz of course who sings the notes very well and with a beautiful tone (his voice was the definition of what "tenor" means), but I really feel it should be sung in Italian to gain the full measure of the song. It simply looses too much in the translation. But more than that, it requires a sense of heart, specifically an Italian heart, that Fritz simply did not have or could not find to convey the song properly, try though he may.
I feel the same way with his magnificent "Granada". His voice is nothing short of magnificent but the words in German that he uses are different, not only in their sound of course, but in meaning from the original text. What does the Sierra Nevadas (the mountains outside of Granada, Spain) have to do with the Black Madonna as Lara wrote it? I am sure Lara, the composer of "Granada", would cheer and applaud the voice of Fritz Wunderlich but when it was over he would then ask Fritz whose song he was singing. A tour de force for Fritz for sure but only to showcase his voice, nothing more. In short, it is not enough Latin in flavor and just too, too, too Teutonic. A perfect example of Fritz singing Fritz, rather than Fritz singing Lara.
In "Granada" and "Non ti scordar di me", I am thrilled by Wunderlich's voice but I am also thrilled by Lanza's singing with the added enhancement of his using the correct lyrics and meaning and in the correct languages, not to mention the straight forwardness of style he uses to go directly to the heart of the composers' intent. In the case of "Granada" for example, Lara commented that Lanza's rendition was just what he had in mind when he wrote the piece.
Turning to your example, as good as Wunderlich's voice sounds in "Vergiss Mein Nicht", I am still not convinced it is "Non ti scordar di me", in the core melody perhaps, but not in style or in words. Certain songs require a certain way with the tune and this song in particular needs a true "Italiante" style that escaped Fritz when singing most of the Italian songs he recorded (he was more effective when singing Italian opera arias, even when he sang them in German). Listen to Lanza, Schipa, DiStefano or Gigli and you will hear how the song should be presented. In some cases, Italian song in particular, it is more important to have the correct style than the best voice. Better yet, go here for the master lesson and example of this from an old man with only half the voice he once had but a singer with an Italian heart who knew exactly the style needed to communicate this song properly:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-cyNktoTNM
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Rob
05-24-2012
08:40 PM ET (US)
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Rob
05-24-2012
08:25 PM ET (US)
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Another song containing a plea not to be forgotten is this pretty tune, sung by another fine tenor:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5-a3ZQtcBk
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