Hi,
New to this site but would love some experienced advice. We decided after much stalling and deliberation to add a horse to our lives...1.As a comapanion/passion/hobby for our daughter(14yr old. I owned a horse in my 20's and have always loved them. Now I'm in my early 50's and riding again is something I am also entertaining...so is my husband. We recently got turned onto the Icelandic, thinking that the breed would suit us perfectly... a fun but safe ride.. We would be going on trail rides and possibly the occasional gymkana.

We went to look at 2 Icelandics yesterday. Currently owned by a lovely German lady that can no longer ride..who clearly loves her horses and has owned horses most of her life. They were 7 and 8yrs. 1/2 brothers and larger...14.2. Very cute..but VERY fat and Very out of shape and to be honest I'm not sure how much formal training they have really had. My daughter hopped on the back of one and under halter she had a very tough time getting the guy to respond to leg pressure or neck reining....in fact he seemed quite uninterested in doing anything...but plodding along.

The lady was embarrased slightly but said that at this time they were like 300 pound men. And that if they were ridden well and often they would be entirely different animals from an energy standpoint. She clearly feels bad and know this is not good for their health.

Sorry...long time getting to the point. These boys are obviously going to need some good training and conditioning. We would have to pay for someone to do this with the hope they would be transformed into the fun energetic icelandic horses we hear about and would love to have?

The idea of having 2 icelandic appeals a great deal as it's always more fun to have someone to ride with and the price is right for the two of them. Is this worth pursuing?

Fh0m5X

CD Key
Diablo 2 CD Key
Starcraft CD Key
Warcraft 3 CD Key

I have a five year old Icelandic gelding who is taking very well to driving training. I recently got a really good deal on a practice cart. They said they had driven Haflingers. My Vindur is the Hummer model Icelandic and he doesn't fit the poles. I am going to shop for replacement poles but I can't take him along. Any of you folks who are knowledgeable about driving Iceys have any guidelines for measuring the poles so these fit him?? He is a full 14 hands and built like a draft horse. Please answer to stonedesign1@earthlink.net. Thanks

Edited by author 02-21-2008 08:57 PM
Here's a beautiful inspirational video with Icelandic Horses:

http://iceryder.net/videoinspiration.html

View the synopsis of the article written by a German magazine, Cavallo, about the Icelandic Horse World Championship and the abuses:

http://iceryder.net/cavalloarticlesynopsis.html

There are several videos of Icelandic Horses at http://youtube.com/icehorses

Thank you, Judy . The information on saddle fit is very helpful.

Ellen

Saddle fit is an important topic with Icelandic Horses / Ponies.

Some Icelandic Ponies (Horses) are very short backed. The length of the saddle should not sit past the last rib of the Icelandic's back.

Here are a few pictures showing where to locate the last rib:

http://iceryder.net/lastrib.html

>>old. So what, exactly, should we be doing with his? Can we start leading
him with a halter and lead rope
 
Hi...you can do a ton of stuff with your baby IcePony. You can start doing ground training and ground driving. Clicker training. You can pony him on SHORT...EASY....FLAT.. rides.
 
You may also want to join the YahooGroups list IceHorses
_http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses_
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses)

Re: Starting Horses

"I have heard that Icelandics should not be started on any kind of ground work until they are 4 years old."

"I have had conflicting advise."

It is to the horse's advantage to do groundwork and have positive human interaction as young as possible.

The way they do things in Iceland may not have logical reasons for us. For them, not working with young horses came about most likely because they have too many horses to work with, the horses may not have enough nutrition, and they are not experienced in training and working with young horses (i.e. if they did it wrong and created pushy youngsters, then it may have come about to say "do not work with young horses; it is not a good thing to do").

Young horses, as in any young living thing, have a great capacity to learn things better at a younger age. It helps create more neurons in their brains, making them smarter, and preparing them for their future as riding horses and being exposed to things they will encounter in their adult "jobs".

See the pages at:

http://iceryder.net/brain.html

http://iceryder.net/discrim.html

http://iceryder.net/learn.html

http://iceryder.net/good.html

Judy

I also have a 2-year old Icelandic that I bought with his mother last year. I have had conflicting advise. The bottom line is that they should not be ridden until they are 4 or 5 years old. However, I don't think it would hurt to teach him ground manners. It's a lot easier when they are young. I have been playing some of the Parelli games with my Icelandic. They are so friendly and want to be in your pocket, therefore, they need boundaries just like any other horse. Pick up his feet, lead him around, teach him to yield to pressure. None of these things will hurt him.
Sandi
< replied-to message removed by QT >

I am a brand-new owner of a beautiful 2-year-old Icelandicgelding. We have 3 "regular" horses (a quarter horse, a Tenn. walker and a paint), but I have heard that Icelandics should not be started on any kind of ground work until they are 4 years old. So what, exactly, should we be doing with his? Can we start leading him with a halter and lead rope?

Thank you for your advice! However The sights you sent say no advertising allowed...As I need to discuss a trade Thanks Betty.
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Thank you ! Betty

< replied-to message removed by QT >

More new pages at http://iceryder.net/newpages2.html

Hi Betty, there's a couple of places that you can post your message:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

and

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gaitedhorse

Judy
http://iceryder.net
http://clickryder.com

Hello, Im a Paso Fino breeder in Colorado ... I am wondering If anyone would have a Icelandic mare they would trade for a registered Paso Fino I need a small horse for my personal riding.. My pasos are from 14/2 to 15 hh Thanks

New Icelandic Horse videos: http://iceryder.blogspot.net

Updates at http://iceryder.net

See the News Feed towards the bottom of the page.

You might post your saddle on the icehorses list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Send a blank email to icehorses-subscribe@yahoogroups.com to subscribe, or click onto the Join This Group link at the above URL.

Judy

I am looking for a group in Alberta, Canada that does Endurance Riding with Iceys


Maria

badyk@telusplanet.net

I have a beautiful "Sensation" treeless saddle and Skito pad for sale. The saddle is brown and black and the Skito pad is brown.
I have used it only twice and find that it is too big for my little guy. This saddle is very,very comfortable. As I said is is brand new.I rode in it only two times to try it out. I am asking $1200 complete or best offer.

Thanks

Maria
email-badyk@telusplanet.net

Hello everyone

I like to let everyone know, that there will be an

International Icelandic Horse Breed Evaluation
in Vernon, BC, August 2-4,2006

August 2+3
conformation only,rideability for horses 4 years and up Judes: Barbara Frische, John Siiger Hansen
August 4
foals and horses up to 4 years judge: Barbara Frische

for more information please contact me at
toltaway@uniserve.com

Not necessarily. It depends on the conformation, their loins (width), back (length), substance (bone), mental maturity, etc. as well as weight of rider, and what type of riding.

The forced-type riding that we generally see of Iceland should not be done with any young horse as it would make them mentally sour, and possibly negatively impact them physically.

See the schedule of bone fusion for more info:

http://iceryder.net/fusion.html

Whereabouts are you located? Are you using natural horsemanship type methods? any clicker training? (Icelandics love clicker training!)

Check in on our email list for more input on your question:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Also, the monthly newsletter: http://iceryder.net/newsletter.html

Judy

Beverly, it all depends on the size of the horse and bloodlines he or she has ( as Icey owners will tell you). Some bloodlines require further maturation than others. Generally, a horse about 4 yrs old can be started in ground work. Sometimes, they can be started under saddle -- usually they can by the age of 4. If you horse is of one of those later maturing bloodlines, or if your horse is not mentally ready to start work then wait until it is 5. If you have trained horses before -- you should know how ready your horse is. Talk to some of the Icelandic trainers too to get their opinions. As with everything else, there are many schools of thought and you will need to decide what's best for your horse.

Hope this help,

Susan


>From: QT - Beverly <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 27 Jan 2006 15:16:53 -0800
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

>>they have to be at least 5 years before you can ride them<<

Not necessarily. It depends on the conformation, their loins (width), back (length), substance (bone), mental maturity, etc. as well as weight of rider, and what type of riding.

The forced-type riding that we generally see of Iceland should not be done with any young horse as it would make them mentally sour, and possibly negatively impact them physically.

See the schedule of bone fusion for more info:

http://iceryder.net/fusion.html

Whereabouts are you located? Are you using natural horsemanship type methods? any clicker training? (Icelandics love clicker training!)

Check in on our email list for more input on your question:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Also, the monthly newsletter: http://iceryder.net/newsletter.html

Judy

I have an ice. that I'm training but someone told me that they have to be at least 5 years before you can ride them and I need to know if this is true? Because I've broke a few horses before but this is my first Icelandic horse.

 Beverly

Ann, I'll forward your message to the icehorses list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

A few questions for you: is your horse good at dressage? is he mostly a trotter?

If you move him, does he have to remain in a stall?

Judy

Edited by author 12-11-2005 02:43 PM
I have an icey at a barn strictly for icey. problem is i want to ride him dressage and they think im crazy. im afraid to move him to a regular barn with all types of horses because he'll then be in a stall and fed like the big horses. should i be afraid, or do many of you have your ice. horse boarded this way?

I would suggest lessons on gaited horses with natural trainers first. I think there are several in your area.

How about this one: http://www.donwest.net/schedule.htm

Or:
http://www.gaitwayfarm.com/index.cfm

http://www.libertyfarmrockies.com/

http://www.rockingzmules.com/

http://www.walking-horse.com/hillviewacres/

There's probably more.

Try to get a trainer that does not use boot or shoes or other types of weights on the feet. Try to get lessons on naturally gaited horses. Look for a trainer that does not rely on special "gaited horse" saddles, no whips, no nosebands, no big bits.

Join the gaited horse list for more information from other gaited horse owners, breeders, clinicians, judges, etc.:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gaitedhorse

and the icehorses list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Judy

Edited by author 11-03-2005 07:10 PM
Are there Icelandic horses available in NE Wisconsin? I'm a retired woman who started riding lessons last fall after an absence of 40 years! I'd love to try a gaited horse now that I am older. Have ridden a Moriesian and a Kentucky Saddle, and am improving daily.

Thanks so much for the info on possible saddles. I don't really perfer western style, more like a kind of endurance type I guess. I don't care for the horn sticking me in the belly when I duck under a branch. You gave me some good leads.

To sign up to the monthly Icelandic Horse Connection Newsletter, please go to http://iceryder.net/newsletter.html.

<!-- Start Bravenet.com Service Code -->
<div align="center">
<div style="padding:0px; border:1px solid #999999; width:235px; margin: 0px;background-color:#F2F4FA;">
<form action="http://pub6.bravenet.com/elist/add.php" method="post" style="margin:0px;">
<div style="background-color:#DBE0F5;padding:3px;font:12px arial;color:black;">The Icelandic Horse Connection Monthly Newsletter</div>
<div style="margin:10px; font: 11px arial; color: black; text-align:right;">
<div style="margin-bottom:5px;">Enter your name and email address below:</div>
Name: <input type="text" name="ename" size="25" maxlength="60" /><br>
Email: <input type="text" name="emailaddress" size="25" maxlength="100" /><br>
<input type="radio" name="action" value="join" checked style="border: 0px;"/>Subscribe 
<input type="radio" name="action" value="leave" style="border: 0px;" />Unsubscribe 
<input type="hidden" name="usernum" style="border: 0px solid black; height: 0px; width: 0px;" value="456490429" /><input type="hidden" name="cpv" style="border: 0px solid black; height: 0px; width: 0px;" value="1" />
<input type="submit" name="submit" value="GO" /></div>
<div align="center" style="margin-bottom:5px;"><img src="http://assets.bravenet.com/cp/bn-elist.gif" alt="Free Mailing Lists from Bravenet.com" border="0"></div></form>
</div></div>
<!-- End Bravenet.com Service Code -->

Here's the new address for the IceHorses Map:

http://www.frappr.com/icehorses

Put yourself on the IceHorses map!

http://www.risingconcepts.com/frapper/icehorses

If you have horses for sale, this is a good tool for letting people know where you are!

Please let me know more info. I'm in So CA. Email me at iceryder @ sbcglobal.net

Thanks!

WANTED- Home for Icelandic/Haflinger- I would like to find a home for a rescued 3yo, yellow dun mare. She is not abused, neglected or in need of medical treatment.
Rescued from a ranch foreclosure. She is gaited, healthy,
athletic, unflappable(mostly), surefooted, friendly, SMART and has had groundwork training.
I will GIVE her to the right home. I would like her to go to a home that is familiar with the breed and will use her as a pleasure horse, since she is 1/2 Icelandic.
If you or anyone you know may be interested in her, please contact me @ jcgonzales@sbcglobal.net. She is in Santa Rosa, CA..
Thank you

Denise,

I've found several saddles that work for my wide, short-backed Icelandics. Do you paricularly want a western saddle? I think those are harder to find (at least "off the shelf") because skirts are typically long. I assume you'd like treeless because you mentioned the Bob M, and are riding bareback. There is a yahoo group that focuses on treeless saddles (treelesssaddles) that you might want to join - great info in the archives, and a lot of members own Icelandics. My personal favorite is the reasonably priced Sensation, made by Nickers Saddlery (www.nickerssaddlery.com). There is a waiting list for a Sensation, but a FEW are starting to show up used on www.endurance.net and on www.skito.net. They are like riding on a pillow, and yet still secure! Some other people like the Torsion, Barefoot, or the FreeForm SB model (SB:short-backed model, their standard is too long for most Icelandics.) I also own a Bob M that works for most of my Icelandics, at least in the small-medium seat sizes.

The Free 'N' Easy flex panel saddles may be worth looking at too (www.mossrockendurance.com) but they are pretty expensive. Their panels are shorter than some of the other flex panel saddles, like American Flex. We just found a nice used FnE for my husband that seems to work very well for his Icelandic and him.

I haven't heard very good things about the Imus saddle, but I've never ridden in one.

Hi Denise,

I think there is someone who has one of those saddles. Personally I wonder about the position that the saddle puts you in (because it sets the rider towards the back of the saddle), which is more pressure on the weaker part of the back. True, that's how some riders get gait from their horses, but I don't think I'd use one.

The Goertz is definitely a thumbs-down, in my opinion. I have one and keep it for saddle demos to show poor fit.

You might check the archives of the IceHorses email list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

The archives are open and you should be able to search for "saddle fit" or "saddles", etc. A good number of people have gone to the Sensation Pad, and there are several good reports in the archives which you may find informative.

I have a Bob Marshall myself, but I ride bareback alot.

Judy

Has anyone tried a Brenda Imus 4 beat saddle on their Icelandic horse? I have a very wide Icelandic mare and am having a hard time finding a saddle that will work for her. I presently have a Goertz Icelandic that fits her width but it bridges and I am afraid if I use it on her it may create damaged skin and a sore back eventually. I have been going bareback when I ride because I don't have a good saddle for her. I did have a Bob Marshall treeless but ended up selling it because when put on this mare I had to put it so far back off her soulder it went too far back on her loins. Any suggestions?

Hi Judy:
I though I had Kveldrooi listed too but couldn't find it. Tandri has been sold. If you could delete it that would be great. Thanks. Denise

Denise, I see one horse for sale by Denise, named Tandri. Is that one of them? Which is the other?

Judy

Hi:
I have a couple Icelandics listed for sale on the classifieds off The Icelandic Horse Connection and they have been sold. I don't know how to delete them or mark them as sold. Please help. Thanks. Denise

Hi Maria, I'm in Fallbrook if you want to take a ride down here. Also Trish is in Trabuco area. Maybe we could meet at her place. Email me at iceryder @ sbcglobal.net (take out the spaces before and after the @).

You can join the icehorses email list for more info:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Hello,

I am trying to find a trainer in Southern California who would have a lesson horse and be willing to teach me to ride an Icelandic. I am interested in buying but would like to update my riding skills first. I live in Yorba Linda, Ca. Thanks

Maria

Hi Carole,

Try US Nutritionals....

Susan


>From: QT - carole <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 7 Aug 2005 09:13:46 -0700
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Susan.......just the basic ones: dandelion leaf, nettles, kelp, milk thistle.

Hi Carol,

Which herbs are you talking about?

Susan


>From: QT - carole <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 2 Aug 2005 10:13:54 -0700
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

I'm trying to find out if the herbs that are fed "local" horses are O.K. for the Icelandic breed.

Thanks..............carole

More info on summer eczema, founder, insulin resistance at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

or:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses/me...ery=summer%20eczema

and:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses/me...earch?query=founder

Hi Folks,

Would anyone be interested in participating in a horse show and clinic weekend in Tunbridge, VT? We are interested in renting the fair grounds and race track. We have several clinicians/trainers from Iceland who are interested in attending, one being an FT judge. If you are the least be interested or curious, please contact me at deerfieldfarmvt@msn.com It will be a "fun" learning show and the clinics should be awesome.

Thanks,
Susan


>From: QT - Rocky Mountain <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 21 Jun 2005 14:24:42 -0700
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Check out www.easyridingrockies.com for information on Rocky Mountain Horses and links to other websites!

Beth, thanks for the update. I have forwarded it to Dr. Barbara Sollner-Webb.

Dr. S-W also adds:

   Having gotten several responses on our preliminary survey of founder in Iceys (thanks!), it appears that several responders have had more than one founder case, and presumably others (who did not respond) have had no cases. What are the differences?

   ALSO, A SURPRISINGLY LARGE FRACTION OF THE SO-FAR-REPORTED ICEY FOUNDERS WERE IN THE WINTER! THIS APPEARS UNLIKE BIG HORSES, WHERE I BELIEVE GRASS FOUNDER IS MAINLY A SPRING/FALL THING. I AM WONDERING WHETHER ICEYS, HAVING EVOLVED WITH MEAGER RATIONS IN THE WINTER, GET MORE EASILY UPSET BY WINTER GRASS.
 
   With these notions in mind, let me now slightly revise the survey, and ask EVERYONE to respond. Please!

If you have NOT had an Icey founder:

  (i) how many Iceys do you have?

  (ii) do they graze on new spring grass, and how lush is it?

  (iii) what fraction of these iceys are a good weight, and what fraction are chubby or fat?

  (iv) how carefully are the horses observed each day, or could a mild founder case slip by?


If you have (or had) an Icey who has shown founder/laminitis, in addition to the original questions:

  (1) at what age did it developed?

  (2) has the Icey tested positive for Cushings?

  (3) did the Icey have free grazing?

  (4) was the Icey shod?

  (5) if the founder/laminitis is/was successfully managed, how?

  (6) how many other iceys, especially ones of similar age, live under the same conditions and have not developed founder/laminitis?

... I am now asking you to also answer:

  (7) was the horse: thin? ok weight? chubby? fat? or obese?

  (8) if you feel that this founder was, at least partly, from grazing, how new and lush was the grass?
  
    (A) If it occurred when grass is just coming and especially lush (i.e., late spring or early fall), was the grass more lush than the horse had the previous years?

    (B) Or (unlikely) was it at a time when the grass was sparse, dry, or grazed short?

    (C) Alternatively, might it have been in the winter, maybe when the horse got out on some grass it usually wasn't on, even if the grass didn't seem lush?
 
         PLEASE ANSWER -- IF WINTER GRASS IS SOMETHING THAT ICEYS HAVE SPECIAL TROUBLE WITH, IT WILL BE IMPORTANT TO KNOW, TO WARN PEOPLE ABOUT!

thanks much!
yours, Barbara in Maryland

Judy - as promised I am updating on my gelding Ljufur with leptospirosis and founder. He feet are doing well - he is walking comfortably and my farrier is keeping the heel trimmed every 2 weeks. The radiographs indicate approx 4 degree rotation on lf front and 3 on the right. However, his eyes are not good. He has been taking off his mask every day and the light has been affecting his eyes. They are not swollen, but his vision is not good. It is hard to tell how much of his slow walking is from not seeing and how much from hoof pain. He is in pasture with another gelding and a mare and the mare has elected to become Ljufur's "seeing eye horse". They were always close, anyway. I suppose I could lock Ljufur up in a box all day and keep him out of the light, but I cannot do this. Also, for the founder freedom of movement is necessary so the two ailments are working against one another. I was looking for another icelandic 2 years ago, but was diagnosed with breast ca and gave up looking to concentrate on getting thru surgery/chemo, etc. Also, did not know what my outcome would be. Now, I wish I had another icelandic in the wings. It would make it easier to do what is best for Ljufur.

I just read a message posted early in May which asked for input into a survey about laminitic Iceys. I don't know if that survey is closed or not, but I'll add my experience.
Judy, will you please send my info on to Barbara? Thanks!

I have a 14 year old Icey gelding who is always shod and never free grazes. He had an episode of laminitis that started in May of 2002 or 2003, so he was 11 or 12 at the time. His laminitis was probably triggered by metabolic changes brought on by obesity. His weight had crept up to a high of 920#. His insulin was high, but we did not test him for Cushing's. He had 3% of rotation when diagosed. His feet are now normal and his weight has been in a normal range of 680#-720# for the last couple of years. He is a very easy keeper. He is fed bromegrass hay and supplements only. It took a year to get all the excess weight off him. We retested his insulin level after one year and it was normal.

Management of the laminitis involved me, my vet and my shoer. Radiographs were taken at the onset, and several times during treatment. His feet were trimmed per Dr. Ric Redden's method and I taped blue foam to his feet to support the coffin bone. He was trimmed several times during recovery. I kept him in a deeply bedded 12x12 stall for 3 months, until he was completely sound. He was on low-dose bute in the beginning. I started him on a Chinese herb blend reputed to help with hormone levels. I'm sure it helped the outcome that I recognized the signs of laminitis right away, having dealt with recurrent laminitis in a different, Cushingoid horse.

Last winter my Icey had a period of tender feet, so we treated him as if he was laminitic, but did not pull his shoes because it was December and he needed the traction of borium tips. I gave my horse 1/2 to 1 gram of bute once a day for a month, but no other medicine. I kept him in his small paddock, with access to a heavily bedded stall. He chose to lie down a lot when his feet were first sore, then he laid down less and less. He was perfectly fine after a month and since then, but I watch him closely. He will always be susceptible to laminitis.

Kay in Fairbanks

Judy: Thanks for forwarding my info to Barbara, who emailed me last night at home and offered a suggestion about a natural trimming book. Forget the name. I have already ordered a book by a well known vet on founder. This is not looking good. And, yes, Ljufur is an easy keeper, but then all three of my horses are. Since this foot problem I have been giving Ljufur "horseshoers friend" by Farnum. I realize it will be a year before any sort of visable results. I am doing all I can but in all reality I wonder if I am just prolonging the inevitable. I am hoping the leptospriosis is (was) an acute case and does not reappear. One good bout of that along with this founder will be more than I can bear to watch. And, if the lepto proves to be chronic, the prognosis is very bad.

Oh, Beth, how sad! I hope he has the best outcome possible. Is he an easy keeper, by any chance?

Judy

I will send a detailed message to Barbara in Maryland. I believe I am dealing with founder right now in my icelandic. Long story made short he was diagnosed with leptospriosis in February, ran considerable feaver, eye pain, etc. Now we have abcess in right front foot and I think the other front foot is also going. Have not go him sound enough for trailer ride to vets for radiographs, but farrier thinks we have rotation and so do I. Will keep you posted. I am heartbroken. Ljufur is 13 this year and an amazingly fast, happy pony, but not now.

I have no horses that have foundered.

Susan


>From: QT - Judy <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 2 May 2005 23:26:02 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Hi Sandi!

You said "I encountered a problem where she would not go down a somewhat rocky path to cross a creek."

Do you have any idea how much training the horse has previously had? and what type training?

What type of saddle were you using?

If she's had all of her basic, foundation training, she may respond with clicker training.

We use clicker training with our horses. There are quite a few pictures of different training situations here:

http://iceryder.net/sitemap.html

Please feel free to join us on the icehorses email list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Judy

Hi Ru!

You said: "I don't have the papers for them. He said he had the papers, and then said he needs to get them from the widow, who says we need to get them from the breeder - you get the idea. Now the bay was imported and carries a brand on her neck under all that hair. The grey its hard to tell. Now I am assuming these mares were DNA'd at one point. Is there away I can get papers for these mares?"

I guess it depends. Do you have any idea of their registered names? Or who / where they came from originally?

You can email me at iceryder @ sbcglobal.net if you don't want to disclose the names here.

Judy

Cushings, Founder, Laminitis / Icelandic Horses Survey

Please forward to other Icelandic Horse owners:


>>>> a breeder [said] that said she had never heard of a foundered Icelandic.

> I think that's probably a myth.


Dr. Barbara Sollner-Webb suggested:

so lets take an informal survey, asking list members to respond, if they
have (or had) an Icey who has shown founder/laminitis. please also include:

(1) at what age it developed,

(2) whether the Icey has tested positive for Cushings,

(3) whether the Icey had free grazing,

(4) whether the Icey was shod,

(5) if the founder/laminitis is/was successfully managed, and how, and

(6) how many other iceys, especially ones of similar age, live under the
same conditions and have not developed founder/laminitis.

i will be happy to record the results!
yours, barbara <<

(Dr. Barbara Sollner-Webb , Professor, Johns Hopkins University School of
Medicine, Baltimore, MD, who has four wonderful Icelandic horses in her
backyard. )


This is a great idea, Barbara!

For those on other lists, please forward this so that we can get as much
input as possible for Barbara.

email input to iceryder@sbcglobal.net


Judy
http://iceryder.net
http://clickryder.com

I have a 6 year old Icelandic mare, that I recently purchased. She has not been on the trails much, and I encountered a problem where she would not go down a somewhat rocky path to cross a creek. I tried using the crop, getting off and walking her down, and a friend even got behind her and tapped her with a crop while I squeezed with my legs to get her to go forward. Any suggestions on what else could be done? We were not successful, and I had to turn around and go back.

I bought two mares off a man who just got them from the family of his brother that just died. He didn't want to pay board on them so I got a good deal. We have really come to love the breed, but I don't have the papers for them. He said he had the papers, and then said he needs to get them from the widow, who says we need to get them from the breeder - you get the idea. Now the bay was imported and carries a brand on her neck under all that hair. The grey its hard to tell. Now I am assuming these mares were DNA'd at one point. Is there away I can get papers for these mares? Either way we would not part with them, but it would be nice to have their papers

I think there's not much natural horsemanship in Iceland, but there is a slight movement towards trying to learn about it. It would be wonderful for you to go there and help spread the word.

Please join us on the icehorses email list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Judy

Hi there,
does anyone of you know natural horsepeople in Iceland? Or even is anyone from Iceland?
Would be nice to me to get an email contact over there.

many greetings from Germany,

Irina, eineschuetzin@gmx.de

Gait Chart:

http://iceryder.net/images/gaitchartpat3.jpg

Pace Happy Horse:

> move on faster she breaks into canter then after 3 of 4 strides
> changes to pace. I believe at present that the main issues are
> building up her strength to carry me but i wonder if her tendency to
> use pace in the field means she will always 'chose' this in
> preference to canter. I have worked her in the field with longlines
> and using the clicker reward her for striking off into canter

Hi Liz! Good for you for using the clicker!

Some horses are not conformed to canter easily. It may require lots of patience and groundwork.

There's an article at http://iceryder.net/canter.html


Judy
http://iceryder.net
http://clickryder.com

For Sale:
Islander Icelandic Saddle. Black. Made by Supreme.
Probably used 10 times. Like New condition. Very nice made all leather saddle. Comfortable padded seat. Med/Wide tree. Will sell for $350.00 or trade for a Saddleseat cutback.

Hi Linda,

What size is the tree?

Susan

>From: QT - Linda Long <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 4 Mar 2005 13:39:49 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Hi,

I have an Icelandic Horse saddle for sale. Black 17" All Leather. Soft leather knee and skirt. Seat is deep padded for comfort. Never used. Fully leather lined, with reinforced leather billets. Comes with English stirrup leathers and regular stirrups. I've never used it and bought it for a trade show.

I can email pictures if you are interested. Asking $100. Suggested retail is $395.

llong76@yahoo.com

I have a nice Icelandic saddle for sale. It is the Icelandic Islander which I've seen listed all the way up to 1150.00. I have it on ebay for 375.00.
They're are photo's on www.tennessee-walking-horses.com

The saddle has hardly been used, one show, a few trail rides.It fits a lot of horses except the one I need it for. Good for short backs, fits a variety at the wither.
email ttimber88@yahoo.com if interested.

Hi, I'm looking for a Icelandic Horse over 10years old, must be a condifence bringer and must be a fun/cheerful charicter, please e-mail me (pictures liked!)
icelandicverity@hotmail.com
Please (I live near Newcastle uk, only e-mail if u live in the uk please

Lincoln, Vermont

Susan



>From: QT - BENJAMIN LICHTMAN <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 12 Dec 2004 13:25:42 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Where do you live, Susan? I'd love to see your gelding. Ellen



  
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
 The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
< replied-to message removed by QT >

I have an awesome black gelding for sale -- 4 yrs old -- just started under saddle and is a great horse.

Susan



>From: QT - Nancy <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 8 Dec 2004 07:17:20 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Ditto! I have 15 -- young, and older trained -- great to be around and work around -- very sensible.

Susan



>From: QT - CjLane <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 9 Dec 2004 16:28:22 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Addendum to Janet's report:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icesavvy/message/1196

I agree, I think these horses learn very quickly!

For some interesting reports, please read Patti's report on her PNH work in Level 3 at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses/message/50041

and Janet's report on her Level 3 at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icesavvy/message/1176

They have been very successful at getting supple, flexible, soft, willing Icelandic Horses!

Judy

Hi Ellen. After thoroughly researching the breed, my husband bought me my first Icelandic last Christmas - a six-month-old black colt. I've discovered that Icelandics are the most sensible horses I've ever worked with - I've become a great fan of these horses. Although it will be some time before my Icelandic is ready to ride, I'm truly enjoying working with him on ground training. He learns quickly, shows great tolerance, hardly ever spooks, and loves to please. I would highly recommend the breed.

Hi Nancy,
 
I have had many horses for myself & my family: grade horses, quarter horses, morgans, arabians, warm bloods and even an andalusian. The latist addition to the barn is an icelandic. His training has only begun but he is already a pleasure to ride! I haven't hesitated to pur beginners on him because he is so sensible and "bomb proof". The biggest asset is that he doesn't spook or pay any attention to strange sounds and sights. I would recommend the breed if youare looking for a quiet, family horse.
Good luck, Ellen

QuickTopic daily digest <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com> wrote:
  
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
 Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Greetings...found you on the net. I am "considering" purchasing an Icelandic
for my animal therapy program. Also, my passion is Parelli and am currently in
the Level 3 phase of learning. What can you tell me about this breed, a
friend seems to think they are very "hot" horses??? I own a Tenessee Walker and
love his temperment/also a fine quarter horse but am fascinated with this breed
even though I don't know much about them. Can you enlighten me????
Thanks.....Nancy

Matilde, try joining our email list as we have people from the UK on it:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

or send a blank email to icehorses-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

Judy

I'm looking for a place to stay next summer. I don't care if it's in Britain or Schottland, I just want to stay their for 3 weeks or something and work, I don't hav eto get any money, but I would be very nice if I could work for board and lodging? I have had icelandic horses since I was 6 and I'm almost 18 now. Do you know where to look? Do you have any contacts? It's not like it's easy to find homepages about icelandic horses in Britain ;)

- Matilde, mail: Matilde_klarskov@hotmail.com

By Mary Midkiff:
http://www.womenandhorses.com/index.html

I have had so many questions lately about saddles and saddle fit as well as
fitting my new horse, Redge, that I think it is time to share more
information with you about this important piece of equipment.

Remember this "A man can ride in a woman's saddle, but a woman cannot ride
in a man's saddle."

Let's start with this idea and move through the various traditions of riding
and riding equipment.

The english saddle traditions come from the military, the cavalry and the
hunt field. Before World War I there were english saddles made specifically
for men and english saddles made specifically for women both side and
astride. World War I changed everything as the demand for cavalry and
military equipment was needed. All other saddlemaking was done away with.
With the disbandment of the US cavalry in the 1950s, military saddles began
to disappear and the hunt saddle for jumping and the cutback saddle for
gaited horses took over for pleasure and show riders. Today, even though
the horse rider market is predominately women, we still have a tremendous
selection of male oriented english saddles and only a handful of female
friendly english saddles to choose from.

The western saddle traditions come from ranching and farming. Late in the
19th and early in the 20th centuries women had western saddles specifically
made for them to choose from including a Mexican and South American variety.
But these saddles had high pommels and high cantels to hold "the lady" in
her seat. This was not desirable to ranch women who wanted to be equal with
the ranch men. Over the last 100 years western saddles have been designed
for their use and not for the sexes. There are barrel racing saddles,
reining saddles, cutting saddles, bronc riding saddles, ranch saddles,
bulldogging saddles, and pleasure saddles. Almost all western saddles are
built for the male body biomechanics and only three or four saddlemakers are
considering the female rider biomechanics.

There are also Australian saddles, endurance saddles and hybrids out there
that are making their way into the mainstream market. These saddles are
almost always custom made giving the buyer the opportunity to have it fit
their body and the horse's body, which of course is the ideal.

If you, as a female rider, go to a stable to take riding lessons you will be
put in a saddle that more than likely will not give you the advantages you
need to learn riding in a safe, comfortable, supportive way. I want you to
realize that yes, you have a lot to learn when you take riding lessons, but
your equipment has to help you in movement not work against you. So, in
these riding lesson situations where you are borrowing a saddle and riding
different horses, try to find a saddle that will work for you. The stable
probably has a large selection. Even if they don't have a female friendly
saddle, don't just accept what is given to you if it hurts, chaffs, pinches,
or keeps you off balance. If worse comes to worse and you just cannot find a
comfortable saddle try buying and using a seat saver. They come in wool and
fleece and fit over any saddle's seat to give you some comfort.

Now, the next question is "What is a female friendly saddle?" The tack
store employees don't know, your instructor probably doesn't know, your
friends probably don't know but you do need to know. And hopefully, in our
lifetime people who are selling and making saddles will all know how to find
a female friendly saddle for riders. It's a tall order I know, but it's one
of my big wishes because in the end the horse's benefit.

A female friendly saddle is a saddle that:

1) Has a seat which supports the female pelvis and gives a base to the
points of the pelvis or seat bones (ischial tuberosities. The seat of the
saddle meets/joins the seat bones and is firmly underneath them. In narrow
twist saddles the female is sitting more on her crotch than her pelvis. She
is literally teatering in the middle with no support.

2) Has a twist or waist to the seat which tapers off slowly allowing the hip
joint and upper thigh to move freely.

3) Supplies the proper amount of rise to the pommel which will alleviate
friction on the pubic symphasis or soft tissue area of the crotch.

4) Places the stirrup bars under the hip joint for proper biomechanical line
up of the leg under the torso.

5) Provides cushioning in the seat for extra comfort and give, tender seat
bones, long hours sitting and menstruation discomfort.

I have a list of female friendly saddle makers on my website but highly
recommend Balance International. I worked with them on fitting Anna's saddle
and am doing so again with Redge and I continue to be impressed with their
service, the professionalism, their attention to detaila and their superior
product. This is a saddle company based in England. Balance International
is owned, run and managed by two women who design and make all of their
saddles. The saddles are made by women for women and if that weren't
enough, they are also the best I have found for the horse.

"Traditional" saddle fitters take tracings of the back of the horse at the
withers and again in mid-back. They make the saddle to fit into the
deficits of the horse's back from those tracings on that day. The saddle
will hold this shape unless it is reflocked, but the tree remains the same.
No matter how the horse grows, changes in muscling, in diet, in exercise, in
age the traditional custom saddle fit remains as it was on the day of the
tracings. People will use pads and shims to adjust the fit as the horse
changes, but the tree holds that initial shape and restricts the horse from
growing and expanding through his back as he needs to in his work over time.

The Balance International concept (please go to their website to read more
www.balanceinternational.com) is to make the tree wide enough for the horse
to always grow and expand under it. The BI saddles look traditional and
some of their models are more traditionally made than others, but the shape
of the tree is allowing and always open for the horse to grow into. It
never restricts or limits the back through any changes. I have seen these
saddles settle horses that were nervous or flighty or bound up in their
bodies. After only a short while in a BI saddle they begin to let down and
relax and stretch out with their necks and through their stride.

BI is only making English style saddles now but hopefully they will, in the
future consider making western and endurance saddles too.

I have ordered a new BI saddle for my new horse and it will last us a
lifetime. It is made to fit me as a female athlete on his back and it
allows him to move without restriction.

As you look at and ride in various saddles notice where and how they affect
you. Keep trying saddles until you find one that works for you. It is an
integral and key part of the horse/rider relationship and has to be
supportive to both of you.

Hopefully, in the next year or two, I will be coming out with a line of
female friendly saddles that everyone can afford. Until then, educate
yourself and continue to search for something that will work for you.
My book, "Fitness, Performance and the Female Equestrian" has all of the
saddle fit drawings for the different genders. Use it as a guide and
contact me if you have specific questions.

A good contact for female friendly western saddles is Dave Genadek at
www.aboutthehorse.com. He custom makes saddles with all of the criteria
listed above for women in his saddle line.

If you have to go the used or borrowed saddle route for now, look for a
saddle with a wide seat that tapers off slowly, a stirrup leather or skirt
that hangs down from under your hip joint not out in front of your leg, a
pommel that has a slow rise to it and when you sit in the seat you shouldn't
feel as though you are sitting on the front part of your pelvis but in the
middle with no soft tissue pressure. The seat of the saddle should not set
you back on your tailbone either. The lowest part of the seat or center of
the seat should meet the center of your pelvis. Also, when the saddle sits
on the horse's back the lowest part of the seat should be level with the
ground.

I hope this will help you a great deal in finding a saddle that works for
you no matter what type of riding you do. Just realize that for now it's a
little harder to fit the female rider properly because the products are
customized and not in the mass market, YET! Stay Tuned... and Happy Riding,
Mary
http://www.womenandhorses.com/

Check out ebay -- they recently had some nice icelandic saddles for sale.
Susan



>From: QT - Marina <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 26 Nov 2004 14:58:24 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

I have a nice gelding that I have started under saddle this winter. He's a breeze to ride and very friendly. Loads of long mane and tail. He's totally black and like a big teddy! $6500 firm - his price will go up with increased training!

Susan

Susan Gulrajani
Deerfield Farm Icelandics
802 453-3247




>From: QT - Judy Ryder <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 26 Nov 2004 19:31:36 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

>>Are there any icelandic horses for sale? I'm looking for my first horse (any icelandics must be trained and a good first timer)!<<

Check the Icelandic Horses for Sale Board at http://iceryder.net

There are some pretty nice ones for sale in Northern CA, trained with natural horsemanship. No need for shoes, nosebands, special saddles, etc. for gait.

>>So it is very important that the saddle fits
perfect and distributes the weight very good.<<

You may want to check into saddles that put the rider in a centered or balanced position.

Icelandic saddles are more on the "saddleseat" side which puts the rider behind the horse, instead of being lined up with the center. This places more weight towards the weaker part of the horse's back.

This is touched on in Rikke Schultz' new book, and the problems it can cause a horse's back (and movement).

The book is at: http://icefarm.com/tackstore/rikkebook.htm

Dr. Deb's newsletter, The Inner Horseman, also addresses this, as well as Master Saddle Fitter Dave Genadek's saddle fitting video: http://www.aboutthehorse.com

I live in Alberta, Canada.

Wrote a post replying to your very appreciated comments, but it was deleted by the Topic Administrator. Can't see a reason for that. Any idea?

hi Marina,

Do you live in Vermont?

Susan


>From: QT - Marina <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 21 Nov 2004 17:05:12 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

I'm planning on going for a one-week trekking to Iceland next summer. Would anyone have any good places to recommend?

Edited by author 11-23-2004 11:51 AM
Are there any icelandic horses for sale? I'm looking for my first horse (any icelandics must be trained and a good first timer)!
verityhall@btinternet.com

>>Does anybody know of any treeless saddles sold before 1999?<<

A few treeless saddles were made around that time from Iceland (including the Floki), subsequent to the positive reports of Icelandic Horses using the Bob Marshall Treeless Sports Saddle.

They really haven't been able to match the fit, quality, or durability of the BM Sports Saddle.

For more info about treeless saddles:

http://iceryder.net/treeless.html

Judy

>>I am looking for a used Astund or Hrimnir saddle with a wide tree.<<

Hi Marina, you might consider a Wintec Dressage saddle. They come with different gullets, including wide and extra wide, and we've found that they fit Icelandics a little better than the *icelandic* saddles.

Susan, of SaddleUp Tack, will give our list members a 10% discount on purchases.

List: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Judy

Does anybody know of any treeless saddles sold before 1999? I know the Galsi and the Diddi Pad were, but are there any others?

Thanks a lot! :)

Astund Saddle:

I am looking for a used Astund or Hrimnir saddle with a wide tree. Please e-mail me any offers with a photo and price to redcougar@telusplanet.net.

Thank you.

More clinic reports:

http://iceryder.net/lizclinicreport4.html

Judy

Also a discussion about feet and trimming on the icehorses list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Judy

New pictures on the neck rope pages:

http://iceryder.net/neckrope.html
http://iceryder.net/neckrope2.html

Judy

Hay Hay Hayley! The racing is different between Tbs and icelandics. Tbs use a track and icelandics use a straitaway. Tb racing is formal and icelandic racing is informal. HTH Kelly

Hey im doing an assignment in my degree about the equine industry in the rest of europe compared to britain. I have chosen iceland and do a comparison with the racing of icelandic ponies compared to the Tbs in britain. I was wondering if anyone knew about websites, information about the racing of icelandic ponies??? Any info would be greatly recieved.Thanksxx

My neighbor has had four icey foals this year and we are all so attached to all of them. I bet none of them are offered for sale! They are so intelligent and learn everything very fast. What fun working with them! They aren't lunged, but taken for walks, handled, groomed, bathed, feet make-believe filed, even taken into the house! What fun!! Smart critters.

Hi Dianna, I provide my horses with a 40-lb. Sweetlix block - it provides all the essential vitamins and minerals in a convenient block. I put a block in their feeders and it usually lasts for several months. I also provide a salt lick for each horse.

Cj; what type of mineral block do you use? Dynamite products are popular in my barn or ABC. Dianna

I'd like to share some information regarding your question about feeding a young Icelandic. My Icelandic gelding is 16 months old and I purchased him when he was six months. He's kept at a small ranch (in a good-sized stall with a shelter area). I feed him quality hay, a mixture of moistened red wheat bran and A&M crumbles twice each week, and I supply him with a mineral block. He's thriving on this diet. This is my first Icelandic and he's noticeably quieter than my other horses when they were youngsters, but I treasure this trait. (He seems to be always thinking and most willing to do anything I ask.) I'm using many techniques taught by John Lyons and I'm very pleased with the results. My gelding is turned out into a large arena every other day and enjoys his time out to frolic, in addition to our daily interactions. I agree that lunging isn't a good idea at this age - instead concentrate on easy groundwork exercises. I live near a river and I take my youngster on trail walks as often as possible - it's good exercise for both of us.

Hi Denise:

>>I always had them on pasture and they always seemed to get what they needed. She has him in a stall with hay and also gives him vitamins. Her vet keeps telling her to give him more grain and take it up to 14%. She knows I told her to be careful with the grain if she decided to give him any. How much grain should she feed him?<<

Personally, I wouldn't do that much grain, but maybe others would.

I think some Icelandic foals are quieter than foals of other breeds. I value that with my filly :-)

Is there any option of the colt being in pasture? Is he in a stall all the time except for when she takes him out?

Care needs to be taken with lunging young horses. Supposedly it's difficult on their joints.

Is there an option of her to "play" with him instead?

To keep his mind stimulated and make him smarter as he's waiting to grow up, she could try clicker training.

Wanted: Icelandic Horses Trained With Natural Horsemanship

        We have been promoting natural horsemanship with Icelandic Horses for several years now, but recently was reminded by the following message that I received, why we started promoting NH for Icelandic Horses:

            "I was very encouraged to find a website interested in promoting natural horsemanship in this breed. I have 4 horses and have decided to add an icelandic to our family. However, I have been dismayed at the condition of the icelandics I have ridden thus far. All have been from iceland and all have been so hard in the mouth, neck and poll. I am not in a position to take on any more projects and rehab situations. Honestly, I need to find the near perfect horse for a green rider. We need a positive experience without a lot of challenges. A bombproof sweetheart! Too much to ask? I hope not."

        Many of the newcomers to Icelandic Horses want this type of horse. In general, in the breed, we're on our way to producing more of these types of horses, as more and more owners are using Parelli (Parelli Natural Horse-Man-Ship), Bill Dorrance (True Horsemanship Thru Feel), John Lyons (Lyons Perfect Horse), TTEAM, or similar training methods. The methods of Monty Roberts or round-penning are not what we're talking about. Generally, the breeders tend to be more traditional, but there are a few who are using natural horsemanship. There just aren't enough trained with natural horsemanship, yet, to be flexible and light, to meet the demand.

        Newcomers also would like easy-to-get soft gaits that come with a naturally gaited horse; gaits that are not dependent on tack (saddles, bits) or forced frames.

        If you have any horses for sale who have been trained with NH, PNH, etc., light, soft, flexible, please let me know! Thanks!

I also have a yearling chestnut Icy filly for sale if anyone is interested. She is by a first prize stallion, Faldur fra Toftum and out of a silver dapple bay mare who is granddaughter to first prize Gustur von Weisenhof. She most likely carries the silver dapple gene hidden in her chestnut coat. She was imprinted and is a real love. I can send pics via email. She is being offered at $2800. She will one day be worth her weight in gold. Thanks.

I recently sold a yearling Icy colt to a lady and she is concerned about the way to feed him. I always had them on pasture and they always seemed to get what they needed. She has him in a stall with hay and also gives him vitamins. Her vet keeps telling her to give him more grain and take it up to 14%. She knows I told her to be careful with the grain if she decided to give him any. How much grain should she feed him? She does lunge him daily and he does get nibbles of grass but she says he never tries to play, kick or buck and is worried about his energy for one so young. I am just trying to find her an answer. I am at gaitedgirl@verizon.net

Another thought on the sheath cleaning:

http://iceryder.net/sheath.html

There's a link to Harley's page which has a picture of a bean.

Judy

Saddle Fitting info:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses/message/46611

Sherlee, clicker training sometimes helps the geldings be so relaxed that they frequently drop and it's easier to clean them. Check the clickryder email list archives for threads on this topic :-) It's something that those new-to-clicker training sometimes wonder about, but it's quite beneficial in the long run :-)

Judy

hey Judy... thanks for writing back.. I have felt and find no bean,, the swelling has subsided and he seems back to normal. In the process of this my three year old gelding Brea is more than willing to visit with "Mr. Hand" also I have cleaned my mare Dawn's udders and vaginal area. I am aware that I should not over clean,, I had been more attentive to Star due to that he would not drop his Mr. Happy,, and was so swollen. Any other helpful hints are welcome.

Hi Sherlee, is your gelding still having problems? Some geldings need to be cleaned more than others. Some don't mind it, some need to be drugged. I generally do not use soap on the horse. I wonder if that could affect the natural "flora" that is supposed to be there? Are you getting the bean out?

Judy

Edited by author 09-20-2004 12:29 PM
I have been having trouble with my gelding...Star, his sheath has been swollen and when I took him to the vet ,, I was told that it was just flies,, little did I know that he NEEDED to be cleaned.. I am very new at this and have been seeking help and info anything that could help... I have been cleaning him with ivory soap and warm water,, read the article "Mr. Hand" and he seems to be doing much better,, the swelling has reduced,,, Does that mean I am on the right track or do I need to be concerned of other things I am not aware of???

www.847.is now in english. A full news website with icelandic horses. Message bord, look realy good take a look

I work my colts with line ddriving in side pull from age 2 to age 4. We walk up and down the hills and canyons,in the neighborhood,past intersections. By the time it comes for a saddle its no problem for them. You say you are working 30 mins on basics,can you describe which basics?

Thanks to all who offered insight to my question.

My partner is very concerned about bone fusion and frog developement, as am I. However, I believe that since the colt has accepted a halter; he can now move on to using a hackamore.
The colt accepts the hackamore and is doing well with it and a saddle lightly cinched. The saddle is a "natural ride" saddle and only weighs about 6 or 7 pounds the hackamore's noseband has heavy gauge supple rubber over it.
I work him for about 30 minutes on the basics and then release him to pasture.
We both want to raise a respectful colt, but as he gets larger, his cute "quirks" have become bad manners.

Am I on the right path?

Someone asked about ground driving on the icehorses email list, to which these pages are helpful:

http://iceryder.net/necklinedriving.html

http://iceryder.net/grounddriving.html

http://iceryder.net/playground.html

Judy

Hi Geo, does your partner object to the saddle and bit or to the fact that you are starting groundwork early?

I would suggest that there's no need to do the saddle and bit now. One reason for not using the saddle now can be found in Dr. Deb Bennett's treatise on Bone Fusion, which can be found here: http://iceryder.net/fusion.html

Another reason to not use the bit this early is that the young horse's mouth doesn't stop growing until after age four or more (which is the reason many horses are started in sidepull, halter, or bozal) and transition to the bit after age 5 or 6.

But in the meantime, there are tons of things to do in regard to making your horse smarter while waiting for him to grow up physically.

Here's an interesting page on the horse's IQ and early learning: http://iceryder.net/brain.html

And here you will find lots of different ground exercises and things to do with young horses:

http://iceryder.net/sitemap.html

Take pictures for us! we can add them to the pages or make a new page for your young stallion!

Judy

Geo, I raised my Quarter horse filly from five months of age and I'm now working with my 15-month old Icelandic gelding. Our ground training includes leading, loading, placing a bareback pad on him (with the cinch tightened up), walking across a tarp, around obstacles and exposing him to every type of sight, sound and experience that I can possibly think of. And you know what? He's a joy to work with. He has become so accepting of everything - he's one of the calmest horses I've ever owned. (And he was totally wild when I brought him home at six months.) I don't think you can start too early with ground training. Why wait until the horse is mature, larger and stronger, before you start exposing them to a variety of training experiences? My Quarter horse filly was wearing a very lightweight saddle at 6 months, and when she turned three, I climbed on board in the round pen - no bucking, no hassles, just a great bond we had developed and an accepting attitude on her part. If you do as much ground work as possible, when the day arrives for the first ride, it's just business as usual - no fights and no fear on the part of your horse. I'd say you're on the right track with your training.

Hi Geo, is there any rush to use a bit and saddle? I bought an import horse who had no groundtraining. He had to be trained all over again and I had to do it myself. Really it was the best thing to happen to us. There are a lot of ground school exercises to do listed on the website icehorses.net. Parelli is very popular alone or paired up with clickertraining. No lunge work needed.

What type of groundtraining are you doing?

Help!
My partner and I have a small Icelandic horse farm and disagree about groundtraining. How soon can you begin ground work for a stud colt, and is a two year old too young to use a bridle and place a saddle on his back (with no rider or weight)?
The horse is accepting of both of these practicea and is a joy to work, but my partner is not and dicourages this training.

Hi Elen - we live in California; however, we just heard of a 6 year old boy who has had a kidney transplant but would love a pony, and his uncle is a farrier with his own horses and would be willing to look after the horse for him, so we are going to meet with them....
thanks for the interest.
m

Hi Benjamin - we live in California; however, we just heard of a 6 year old boy who has had a kidney transplant but would love a pony, and his uncle is a farrier with his own horses and would be willing to look after the horse for him, so we are going to meet with them....
thanks for the interest.
m

Hi Maureen,
 
Please tell me more about your filly, size, bone structure,etc. Where are you located? If it's close to New Jersey, perhaps I'll come to see her.
Thank you, Ellen Lichtman 732 446-3106

QuickTopic daily digest <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com> wrote:
  
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now.
< replied-to message removed by QT >

We have a wonderful year and a half Icelandic cross filly, out of Ammah, sired by a champion Haflinger stallion. She is a rescue ( owner too old and sick to care for her) and we took her to find her a new home - we have her half sister, who is a full Icelandic mare and quite wonderful. We would like to find the young filly a wonderful home - she is a beautiful color, a honey dun, and looks like an icelandic. She is registered with the Haflinger Half Blood registry too. We don't want any money for her but we do want to make sure she finds a home somewhere where her great traits will be appreciated. We have done lots of groundwork with her and she is willing, happy, and interested. She is currently sharing a pasture with a Lipizzan filly and a Chincoteague filly (yes, we do have a variety of horses:-)). Any ideas for a good home for her would be appeciated....

Trausti is for sale http://iceryder.net/blueskies/

I didn't get your email. You can reply to me at deerfieldfarmvt@msn.com
Thanks,

Susan



>From: QT - Allison <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 29 Aug 2004 23:54:07 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Hi Susan:

I did send you some more information, not sure if you got it. Looks like you guys are just up the road from some folks I know in Bristol.

Hi Allison,

I'm interested in your horse.

Can you email me at deerfieldfarmvt@msn.com

Please check out our farm at www.deerfieldfarmvt.com

Thanks,

Susan


>From: QT - Allison <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 27 Aug 2004 22:36:51 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Heartbroken decision that being a mom to 2 young ones means I need to sell my beloved 12 y/o Icelandic gelding. I'm in the CA BAY Area - of you know of anyone looking - here is some basic information on him:
http://www.csmuses.com/happy.doc

He is so wonderful and deserves a really great new family - hopefully with a pasture!

He's ready!

Susan



>From: QT - BENJAMIN LICHTMAN <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 24 Aug 2004 00:54:38 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Hi Ellen, sounds like he might be ready to start gait training if he's solid in his basic gaits.

What type of saddle are you riding in?

Bit?

Any idea what type of gait he offered (flatwalk, foxtrot, saddle tolt, stepping pace)?

They have to be going pretty fast to do a real tolt, so it might be one of the intermediate gaits.

In any case, if he's good at trot, you probably can just tip your pelvis back, and raise your hands a little, and see if he offers the gait.

We started an older brood mare (at age 16 years), bareback and in halter. http://iceryder.net/eir.html She never showed gait on the ground, but after about six months of riding, the young gal was able to do the same as suggested above: tip the pelvis, raise the hands slightly, and the mare started to saddle tolt. Check out the pictures on the above site.

Send pictures of your horse! iceryder @ sbcglobal.net

Thanks! Judy

My horse is 6 years old. I believe that he has been ridden, lightly, for 6 or 8 months. I have broken & trained several horses, both hunters & dressage. We are progressing nicely, being careful to build muscle. I have had the horse for 3 months. He walks, trots & cantors nicely. He bends well at the turns. He will do lateral movements quite willingly. Several times, when we went trail riding, he took several steps in tolt. Should I just wait for him to be ready? Ellen


  
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now.
< replied-to message removed by QT >

>>I'm interested in a wonderful 15 year old mare that is a natural tolter. I would like to enter endurance riding<<

Hi Sharon, you might join the icehorses list and ask more about it there:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

or you can subscribe by sending a blank email to icehorses-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

John Parke is the one with two Icelandics that do endurance. He's on that list. Othere have tried to do endurance with Icelandics, but have not been successful.

You probably will want a horse that trots well for endurance.

Judy

I'm not sure about that -- you may read some articles in Tolt News about endurance riding. There's a guyu, I think out west, who's been doing it for a while with his horse.




>From: QT - Sharon <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>Reply-To: QT topic 26-F82eQqQM9Rm3 <qtopic+26-F82eQqQM9Rm3@quicktopic.com>
>To: QT topic subscribers <qtopic+subs@quicktopic.com>
>Subject: Icelandic Horse Connection
>Date: 20 Aug 2004 21:08:39 -0000
>
< replied-to message removed by QT >

Hi, first time I've posted a message. I'm currently looking at buying my first Icelandic. I'm interested in a wonderful 15 year old mare that is a natural tolter. I would like to enter endurance riding in Canada. The mare has lots of trail time under her belt. My concern is that it takes atleast 3 years to get a horse fit for 100 mile rides and I don't know how many years of trail riding competion I can expect to get from an Icelandic. Can you expect an Icelandic to compete in endurance trail riding till they are atleast 25 years old if kept fit.

Ellen, what age is your horse? Have you done all the groundwork? He should walk, walk, walk, for several months after being started under saddle.

Training pictures here: http://iceryder.net/sitemap.html

Check out the posts on the icesavvy list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icesavvy

There is a trend now, changing from "forcing" gait into getting the natural gait when the horse is ready to offer it.

Judy

I have bought a young Icelandic horse. The general training is coming along very well. I don't know much about the tolt. Any suggestions about information sources to help me with training the tolt?

Where do you live? They are all over the country but spread out. I know a lady in Colorado with one for sale. Someone just posted on the email list a gray horse for sale $8500. I don't know where that one is. Do you want a young one or older one?

I would love to buy an icelandic. I have a quarter horse now. I rode the icelandic horses last month in Iceland. Now I want one of my own. Does anyone have one for sale?

email me with sale info at trimpoint@comcast.net

  You will love them ! I loved them the first time I saw them. I didn't understand much about gait and its been a long haul as my icelandic had some problems to be overcome. If I bought another one it would be young and hand raised by me or by people who believe in teaching young horses to like people.

Hi
I am considering buying an Icelandic but I don't know too much about them. I presently have 3 Haflingers but hut my back in a fall in March and I was told a gaited horse would be better for me. I have never ridden a gaited horse before, do I need to retrain? Would you suggest I ride one before I buy? Or will it just come naturally? How is the temperment? My Haflingers are like big puppy dogs, love people, calm easy to work with, I am looking for the same. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

Susan, do you have photos of your horses and have you decided upon prices? After a friend saw my young Icelandic, she expressed an interest in the breed.

Judy, in response to your question, I saw both of Bo's parents and they're a good size - 13 hands and upwards. (I hope that he will reach the size of his parents when he’s grown.) I'll send some photos soon - I'm going to snap some next weekend.

Parelli Report by Fran:

Had my first "just me and River" Parelli session today. It was short and
sweet. I just wanted to work on backing, circling to the right and
squeezing over a barrel. River got "A's" on all three.

It took a little savvy on my part, but he did well.

First to start the circling, I put my back against the fence and just sent
him in half circles around me - he got that pretty quickly and didn't seem
to mind tooooooooo much going to the right. I could still tell it wasn't
his favorite, but he did it quite willingly. Occasionally, I'd move out
from the fence while he was going to the right - had to move quickly to
keep him going, but we did get several circuits to the right as well as
the left!

I then walked him over to the barrels (we have three end to end right now
to give him room). I sent him over them (right to left) and he went!
Several times. Then I moved him so that he'd be going over them left to
right. Oh, he didn't like that. So, I did as Lila had shown me. Put the
end of the CS in his neck and moved his head over, then put it on his
flank and moved it over, back and forth, back and forth... and more.
Finally, got him in the correct position, sent him and he went!!! Right
over the barrels. Did that one more time - with fewer uses of the CS and
he went over again!

During all this play, we were also doing the yo-yo and I made him stand
away from me for a minute or so. He did all very well!!!

I feel hopeful!

Fran

Hi Susan! It's been a long time! Do you still have Friesians? How many Icelandics do you have? Have you trained any of them?

Judy

IF anyone is intersted -- my dressage trainer will be giving a clinic on Aug 14/15 in Vermont at our farm. She will spend one day on dressage and focus on Icelandics and the other day on jumping. She is certified in both. It's already filling up. Please let me know if you are interested. She also starts horses and tunes them up. Really a wonderful person and rider.

Does any one know of anyone interested in purchasing some young Icelandic horses? I have a beautiful yearling filly -- good for the farrier and is a beautiful red bay. Leads, etc. Nice manners. Also, I have two 3 yr old Black Icelandic geldings that are stunning - they look a little like freisans and look to be big. I breed and raise Icelandics and have these three to sell so far.

Glad to hear that he's doing well. You've done some good work with him!

How tall do you suppose he'll be?

Send some pictures of Bo when you can (you can send them to my email iceryder @ sbcglobal.net).

Congratulations to you and Bo! Judy has helped me for the past three years! We are doing great now and glad to hear that you are doing great, too.

Dianna Y

Hello Judy. I wanted to say thanks again for the information you provided regarding my dilemma of working with the feet of my young, wild Icelandic, Bo. Today my farrier came to trim Bo’s feet (for the first time) and all of my time and effort paid off. Bo was calm, the visit went exceptionally well, and I was greatly relieved afterwards. Bo was so wild when I brought him home that I couldn’t touch him, but today (six months later) he acted like he was used to having his feet trimmed on a daily basis. This is my first Icelandic and I’m very impressed with my yearling’s sensible, intelligent personality. We’re continuing to work on ground training exercises and having a lot of fun:)

From Katie:

I was able to attend two of the three day Alexandra Kurland clinic that was
held at Lin Sweeney's farm in Groton NY on May 22,23,24. It was a great
clinic as always and I wanted to share some of the things we did, for those
of you who are following along with us via this list.



In the March clinic we worked on a lot of body issues with the rider, and
this clinic was working to carry some of that awareness over into our
position on the horse and also into our awareness of the horse's position
and need for body adjustment.



Rather than writing a horse by horse account of the clinic, I thought I
would explain a few of the exercises we used and how they helped the horses.



I arrived late on Saturday and was instantly handed a horse and told to play
the "why would you leave me game." There were about 10 cones set up in a
circle and my horse was in her halter and lead. My job was to lead her
around the cones weaving in and out. I was to click her for staying by my
side and not drifting off to the side with her feet, or looking around. I
also didn't want her to crowd me with her shoulder. The end goal was to
have her moving softly along with me in lateral flexion. I learned a lot of
interesting things. One thing I learned was that it really mattered how I
planned my course around the cones. Depending upon my route, I could make it
easier of harder for her to move laterally with me. I also learned that once
she had the basic idea of the game, the most effective technique was to do
as little as possible. That is, I would take both hands off the lead and
reward her for staying with me, or make an adjustment as needed. The more I
tried to direct her, the more anxious she got. The key was to make the
adjustment in a timely and brief fashion and then let her go back to being
loose.



For those of you who want to try this, here are the details. You can play it
in a halter or bridle. You will have the lead looped over the horse's neck
or the reins over the head. Walk in the same direction your horse is going
and use the same mechanics you would use for any groundwork. That is, you
use both hands to make the correction, one near the withers and one sliding
toward the bit. Once the horse is getting the idea, you can go to one hand
as a quick pick-up, but make sure you are not pulling the horse around.
Alex also had me drop my buckle hand as I was walking along with it near
position. I had a whip in this hand which I also relaxed when she was doing
well.



As a note, I played this game with Willy when I got home and it made me
realize how much he is using pressure on his shoulder to direct him. Doing
it with no hands and just directing him with my upper body is much harder.



We used this game throughout the weekend to warm up the horses and get them
ready for the ridden work. If your horse did well with weaving the cones,
you could try going around the outside of all the cones and making a big
smooth circle. We also used it for one horse that was anxious about birds
in the arena. It helped her to focus and settle down without feeling
trapped.



Sunday morning, we started with a person game. I had never played this
before and it is called the "Creativity game." The idea is to see what
happens and to see if you can get some new behaviors by clicking the trainee
for only new behaviors. Any and all behaviors should be clicked the first
time, but not if they are repeated. This did pose some difficult decisions
on the trainer's part as I had to decide if something was a "new" behavior
or an already clicked behavior with an insignificant variation. I also found
it difficult to have good timing and I couldn't always tell if the trainee
was going to do something new as they might start what looked like a
previously clicked behavior and then add a new variation. It was a challenge
all around. I was surprised at the fact that the trainee didn't get
frustrated when she was not clicked for repeated behaviors. She said later
that she just figured she was getting clicked for picking up things and
since she was getting clicked a lot, she wasn't frustrated. She ended on
the behavior of making a cup of hot chocolate. I was fascinated at how this
came about. She was picking up a lot of things and she picked up the hot
chocolate mix. When I clicked that, she got it in her head that I wanted her
to make it. Since every step (find a mug, shake the bag, tear the top, pour
the mix, turn on the teapot, pour the water etc.) was a new behavior, I had
no choice but to keep reinforcing her every step of the way.



After that we did a little body work on how to access our thigh muscles and
rotate our pelvis so that our thigh lengthened and our leg became longer and
more relaxed. We did this by lying on the floor and feeling how our legs
changed when we rotated our pelvis and tried to become aware of when we were
tensing and shortening our legs and when they were lengthening. We used this
awareness of our thighs later when we were riding turns as you can use your
thighs to support and direct the horse through the turns.



Another recurring theme through the weekend was teaching the horse to go
forward. Alex talks about teaching any body part to move one of six ways. We
had spent some time on left/right and back in previous clinics, so now we
were working on forward. In some ways, this looked like a typical dressage
lesson. The rider would send the horse forward and click him for more
energy. We weren't looking for a fast flat walk, but an energetic, bouncy
walk where the horse's back is really moving. The horse's movement really
improved once we got them going. This exercise was done in both the walk
and trot. Yes, that's the TROT! We were all joking that this clinic was
amazing as everyone got to go faster than a walk..



During the "go forward" session, Alex emphasized how important it was to
make sure your body was moving freely before you ask the horse to move
freely. She says it is helpful to check through the gates in your body (from
James Shaw's Tai Chi) and see if they are all working. Some ways to help
the horse were to move him from leg to leg so that he releases his body and
can go more forward. You can also think of asking him to really stretch out
and down. If a horse is inverted, he can't move with a swinging back and you
won't get the free and active movement we are looking for.



Once the horse was marching right along, Alex had the rider pick up the
reins and using single rein riding, get the horse to release forward into
the contact so that they really stepped up into it. I had a hard time
getting my brain around this as releasing forward into the contact sounds
like an oxymoron, but you could really see it happening. It might help to
think of the horse stretching into the contact.



With some of the horses that had been working at a walk for a long time, the
trot was pretty erratic. Alex had us click for three consecutive strides of
the same thing and then build from there. One horse was a Tennessee walker
and none of us were sure exactly what gait he was doing or what we wanted.
So the rider just picked something he was offering for a stride or two and
clicked that. By the end of the session, he was working up to longer
distances while holding the same gait. We still didn't know what it was, but
it looked and felt comfortable.



The same horse that was upset about the birds got to play what Alex calls
the "squashed road kill" game. Sounds like fun? The idea is to ride a
figure 8 in the end of the arena where the horse is comfortable. Your figure
should be oriented so that when the horse is on the line between the two
circles, they are pointing at the scary end (or object). You click the
horse for walking toward the scary area when they are changing direction in
the figure 8. If the horse is really nervous, your line pointing at the
scary end will be very short as the figure 8 will be walking along the rail,
making a half circle and turning back to the rail, then making a half circle
on the other rein and returning to the rail. As the horse becomes more
comfortable, you can make the circles bigger and there will be more of a
figure 8 shape. I rode this pattern and basically just focused on clicking
for good turns. As my horse became more comfortable, I just slowly asked
her to go farther toward the scary end while walking down that center line.
At one point, she would not stop for her click when she was in an area that
was uncomfortable for her. I could tell when she became more relaxed
because she started stopping for her click again. She also learned about
moving laterally while we were working on the other things as well.



Well, this is just a few snapshots of what we were doing. The horses really
progressed over the weekend and a lot of things became clearer to me. If
you have questions or want more details, let me know.



Katie Bartlett

Elverson, Pa

www.equineclickertraining.com <http://www.equineclickertraining.com/>;



p.s. I have been working on my web site, so if you haven't been there for a
while, you might find some new stuff. Also, I would encourage everyone to
send me their name and information for the members page. Maybe I should
change the name from members, it is really just a list of people who are
clicker training. Anyone can be listed, you don't have to be offering
services. I just want to provide a way for people to be able to find each
other.

We had a practice yesterday with a couple of horses doing serpentines thru a
line of obstacles.

First objective was to lead the horses, winding in and out of the obstacles.
Second was to be able to "send" them thru the obstacles, on line, while the
handler
stayed on the outside, walking a straight line.

This is a good exercise for flexibility, having the horse watch where he
goes, extending the "thread" of how far away the handler can be and still
direct the horse, etc.

A series of pictures showing the course, and the first two objectives:
http://iceryder.net/serpentine.html

Third objective is to accomplish the course at liberty (off line).

Judy

A description of how to work with the platform, and it's benefits, along
with pictures:

http://iceryder.net/platform.html

Judy

Judy, thank you for your help. I greatly appreciate the information. I'll keep you posted.

>>Yes, I’m able to touch and pet Bo on his hind end, tail, back legs and sheath area. He stands quietly for this. He allows me to brush his back legs all the way down to his hooves. But when I try to lift his back feet he begins to dance around and becomes annoyed. <<

CJ, I asked on the icehorses and clicker lists for more input to the situation and you should find more info here:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/clickryder

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icehorses

Look for the message titled: Touching, Lifting The Feet.

I'll put together all of this information in an article, but you can maybe get some help now by reading those messages.

One thing that I usually do in working with back feet, is to tip the horse's head to the side that is being worked on. Sort of a safety factor :-)

Let us know if the information helps you, and how he progresses.

Judy

Judy and Raven, thanks for your replies. Yes, I’m able to touch and pet Bo on his hind end, tail, back legs and sheath area. He stands quietly for this. He allows me to brush his back legs all the way down to his hooves. But when I try to lift his back feet he begins to dance around and becomes annoyed. (That’s when I hope that he realizes that we’re friends – he has tried to kick once in the past.) I wouldn’t be so concerned about mastering this task if his feet didn’t need immediate attention from the farrier (he’s overdue). We’ve been working on this for months, with little progress. Any of your suggestions will be welcomed.

>>e moment I attempt to pick up a back foot he swishes his tail, jerks his
foot from my hand and dances around. (And I&#E2;Pcll confess that being kicked is part of my concern


Have you worked with grooming or touching his butt, tail, belly and sheath? He may need that, and also may have a dirty sheath (?). Have you tried clicker training? Raven

There are several Icelandic Horse items such as mugs, calendars, t-shirts, etc. here:

http://cafeshops.com/gaitedhorse

And a special T-shirt here:

http://cafeshops.com/gaitedhorse.10329469

Judy

Hi CJ!

>>I couldn’t even catch him. We’ve made tremendous progress – he leads, loads, ties and I’m able to lift his front feet and clean them. <<

Congratulations on the progress you've had so far!

>>The moment I attempt to pick up a back foot he swishes his tail, jerks his foot from my hand and dances around.<<

This is probably a normal reaction. Today, we worked with a teenaged brood mare who hasn't had her feet handled much.

I will try to write an article for you, along with pictures, showing how we might handle the situation.

Before going straight to lifting the foot, are you able to groom him around the back end with no problem? Does he show any concern if you brush his tail? Have you touched his sheath area yet?

Judy

Help - I’m stymied and need some suggestions. I’ve been diligently working with my yearling Icelandic gelding for months, and he’s overdue for a visit from the farrier. Bo had his first trim when he was gelded a few months ago (and he was still under the anesthetic). He was really wild and scared when I brought him home from the breeder at six months – I couldn’t even catch him. We’ve made tremendous progress – he leads, loads, ties and I’m able to lift his front feet and clean them. (I use the word “up” and he will lift his foot on command.) However, trying to work with his hind feet is a different story. The moment I attempt to pick up a back foot he swishes his tail, jerks his foot from my hand and dances around. (And I’ll confess that being kicked is part of my concern.) I’m starting to stress because Bo’s hooves need trimmed, but I know my farrier won’t want to work on Bo until he’s agreeable to having his back feet handled.

Hi Robin, what type of champion is your horse?

new owner of ice horse paid quite a bit for him and would like to show and take lessions i was told loki was a 2year running champ he has been shown alot. can any one point me in the right direction I have been riding and taking lessions for 10 years. i ride snd show hunter jumpers mostly warmbloods so i will need some lessions on loki. ty robin from california

Hi all,
Thanks for the info about the flax seed. I have started my horse, 'Bomb's A Rae' on the flax seed as it can't hurt..(I don't think)
Meanwhile OSU has decided to operate and remove whatever they can of the tumor on Wed am. They feel that this will at the least give him some quality of life, making it posible for him to eat which is getting harder and harder. You cannot believe how fast this has grown. Maybe that is good as he still looks great!!..has not lost weight or a glossy coat. They said if it is cancer they can probably do some radiation or chemo. It is the best hope we have so we are very excited about it. Both the vet hosp here and OSU said they have never seen anything like this!
In answer to the question about his breeding. He is a TB who we rescued from racing. His racing owner thought so much of him he had surgery on his knee to remove bone chips. Bomber had to stand in a stall for one yr to recover and then was shipped to Ohio for sale where we found him. I have trained and showed him all these yrs and he is a wonderful Prix St. George dressage horse..retired now to his new and third career of trail riding.
Of course his main job is beloved family pet and friend which he does very well. If I knew how your site works I would include a picture.
Thank you all for your concern. I will let you know how things progress. At least now he has a chance.
Sincerely
Cheryl Lee

The Cloverleaf Pattern:

http://iceryder.net/cloverleaf.html

The Lateral Movement of Foals:

http://iceryder.net/lateral.html

Introduction to the Halter:

New photos at http://iceryder.net/firsthalter.html

Oh I love Debby's website! She has such a nice grouping of horses and the baby pix are so sweet (goes with her ranch name). Hey is everybody shed out by now?

Try this http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-...8&q=flax+seed+tumor Is your horse icelandic?

Hi Cheryl Lee, I don't know about how it works with horses but my mom who had cancer takes flax supplements. There is plenty of information about it at www.femhealth.com/FlaxSeedOil.html

How did you notice the tumor and how long has he had it?

{{{{Hugs to you}}}}

I saw on your list that there is some thought that flax seed may reduce tumors in horses. Does anyone have any information about this? My horse has developed a huge tumor in his mouth. I am waiting for a second opinion from Ohio State U. Vet hosp. as to what options..if any we have. Meanwhile if any of you have any suggestions I would be SO VERY greatful.
My email is:sales@threadcrafters.com
Thanks so much.
Cheryl Lee

And take a look at Debby's website:

http://shortnsweet.com

More baby pictures:

http://iceryder.net/images/babyruncompa.jpg

> A horse may show reluctance to perform certain maneuvers that
> have resulted in interference, and may try to avoid circular or
> lateral work by stiffening the back and working with short
> hopping strides with the hindlimbs.

This could be why some Icelandic Horses do not like to tolt in an arena.

OK I'll try it. Send me a pic. Natalie,The sales horses are on the iceryder site.

Here's an interesting topic from Adams' Lameness in Horses book and may answer some of the questions that I had about why so many show Icelandic Horses wear boots.

Lateral Gait Defects

A lateral gait defect involves a sideways swing of a limb. Some lateral gait defects result in physical contact with an opposite limb.

Interfering is frequently associated with narrow-chested and / or toed-out horses.

Such chest conformation places the limbs closer together, and toe-ing out predisposes the horse to winging (swinging the limb toward the midline during flight).

The higher up the limb deviation occurs, the greater the torque that is imparted to the limb and the worse the winging-in will be.

The speed and energy level with which a horse moves its limbs has an effect on its tendency to interfere.

A horse may show reluctance to perform certain maneuvers that have resulted in interference, and may try to avoid circular or lateral work by stiffening the back and working with short hopping strides with the hindlimbs.

Looks like the pictures won't show up here, but at least there's a link. Kelly, can you try it?

Let's try to see if the pictures can be posted here. I think they already have to be on a website somewhere.

Test:

<img src="http://iceryder.net/images/DCP_2407filly.jpg">

how do i get to the place where the sales horses are listed? i am looking for a young mare in the mid-west.

Yay pictures! If we cant post them here I can put them on my page.

Can we post pictures?

Hi Dianna,

Bo was solid black when I brought him home on Christmas Eve from the breeder. However, his coat has lightened dramatically and I'm wondering if he's going to be the color of his sire - a Palomino. You're right, babies are so much fun - they're a clean slate with a thirst for learning. This is my first Icelandic and I'm in love. He has seems to have a different temperament than my other two horses – a Quarter horse and a TB/Appy. He’s very loving, extremely intelligent and always ready to please. My husband says he has “kind” eyes. Everyone at the ranch where I board Bo is smitten - he looks like a fuzzy toy horse. (I'm not certain how long it takes to lose his baby coat, but with daily brushing I hope he'll be a lot less hairy by summer.) By the time Bo matures and we’re able to ride the trails in my area, we’ll have a great bond and have mastered all of the groundwork.

Cjlane, how fun for you to have a baby horse. What color is he ? I sure would like to raise a colt. Icelandics are so smart !

By Dolores:

I've had some trouble putting these pieces into words and into sequence. So,
bare with me. I think this is the first step. But, I may change my mind as I
write the other pieces.

Prior to beginning this exercise I would like to have in place the bend to a
stop explained in passenger lesson. However, if you haven't done the
passenger lesson, it can be built out of the ability to turn or preferably a
give and a yield of the hip. In a turn towards the wall or rail there is a
moment where the there is a stop. In a green horse, this may or may not be
accessible. It depends on the level of excitement in the environment and the
clarity and precision in riding and the level of understanding of the horse.

It is also dependant on a good, better, best, yield the hip. I believe this
has been explained before, but as a refresher as you are walking forward you
will ask for the jaw to give, then you will ask for a better give and a best
give. Then you will look back at the hip and ask for a give which causes the
hip to yield.

Now, you can spend your time riding to a halt. A single cone will do for
this. Ride towards the cone. When you reach the cone stop riding. If enough
time has been spent in passenger lesson the horse will feel that you have
stopped riding and stop. C/T.

But, due to the conditions of the day, the excitement of the horse or
tension that still exists in our bodies the horse may not stop at this point
and the horse will continue past the cone. As he passes the cone, look back
over your shoulder and slide down the rein to guide him in a fairly tight
turn back towards the cone. By looking back at the cone, your body will be
asking him to yield his hip. As soon as you turn, lower your energy again
and stop riding. You'd like him to feel that you are not asking for forward.
If at any time, he stops, allow him to do so and be still for a few moments.
At this point, you may mark and reward him for standing still relaxed. And,
remember "no unrequested forward"

He may still not stop even after passing the cone a second time. As soon as
you are past the cone again, look back and slide down your single rein to
turn towards the cone again. Continue to repeat the turns until the horse
stops. In the beginning, feel free to C/T anytime he stops.

If he hasn't stopped at the cone, go ahead and start again after a short
stop.

Your goal will be to ultimately to stop at the cone by him reading the drop
in your energy. So, if he does stop by the cone, C/T. If you have been
C/T'ing the stops that did not occur at the cone, be sure to jackpot the
stops at the cone.

The cone will give you something to focus on in riding back towards it. And,
riding back towards it will shift his weight onto the hindquarters to
complete the turn. As you look over your shoulder to shift your weight and
body position, use your rein as if it was attached to the cone and the cone
is gently pulling him in towards it.

I do not attach a que to the stop at this point. You are riding along and
the horse discovers the dropping of your energy, and the turns encourage him
to drop his energy. I could call this "coast to a stop". You are not asking
for forward. But, neither are you asking for stop. The horse finds the stop
in you and in himself. And, you C/T him for the finding of it. There is
precision to be learned in ourselves in riding this pattern. How long before
the cone do we need to stop riding so that when he arrives at the cone his
energy will have ceased. What is his "coast" time? Each horse will be
different. Some horses will stop as soon as we stop riding. In other words,
they may stop before we get to the cone. Others might roll right on by the
cone.

For each the goal is still to stop at the cone. Adjust and try again. For
those that stopped before the cone, off you go again forward. For those that
rolled on by, turn and ride back to the cone again. Eventually, you will
find the balance point.

I hope this makes sense.

Dolores

Lateral Work:

Lateral work can be done at the walk and trot with Icelandic Horses, but not in gait. More info:

http://iceryder.net/lateralwork.html

Alexandra Kurland, Clicker Clinic:

Just a last minute reminder to anyone who might be thinking about
attending one of Alex's clinics. We still have openings for 2 more
non-horse participants next weekend,(3 days), May 1 - 3. It is an
advanced clinic, so we will be getting in to more depth on clicker
training. It is going to be held outside of Madison, Wisconsin.
  
As far as I know this is the only clinic she
has scheduled so far this year in the Midwest. You can really learn
a great deal without a horse there!! Hope there are a couple of you
out there who might be interested.

Denise Frye

Sed Alex's website for further details:
http://theclickercenter.com

>>I received a 6-month-old Icelandic colt for Christmas. Since then I've been spending as much time as possible with Bo after work. Talk about wild - he was untouchable!<<

Hi CJ, so glad to hear about your new colt! How exciting! What color is he? Already gelded? Does he live at home with you?

Also glad to hear that you are working with him. There's so much you can do with the young ones. They are smart, and they really like to learn new things. Their brain capacity seems never ended when they learn young.

You can train him to a target, take him for walks, teach his lateral moves; all just a little at a time.

There are some activites that you may want to try here:

http://iceryder.net/sitemap.html

We're always looking for more photos to include, so everyone take pictures! Send them to me at iceryder @ sbcglobal.net

Hi Robyn, I have a Bob Marshall Sports Saddle. I think you may have already seen pictures of it. Quite a few people have gotten them for the mutton-withered horses who are hard to fit.

A couple of pictures here:

http://iceryder.net/saddle.html

Loads of good info about groundwork, body wrap, head lowering, TTouches,
bridges, stiffness, rushing, barn sour, scrambling, etc.

http://www.lindatellingtonjones.com/trail.shtml

Hi all, I recently tried a friend's Bob Marshall sport saddle and love it! Also tried her treeless Tuend and didn't really care for it. Does anyone have any experience/know someone who has exp. w/ the sport saddle and Icelandics? I will be getting an Icey colt next month and want to be sure I get a treeless saddle that will (eventually) fit him. thanks.

Judy, I like the new site format. I can relate to Curtis - my husband finally gave in to my persuasive pleading and I received a 6-month-old Icelandic colt for Christmas. Since then I've been spending as much time as possible with Bo after work. Talk about wild - he was untouchable! Four months later, Bo and I have made tremendous progress – he halters, leads, and I’ve mastered picking up his front feet (we’re now working on the back). Trust is the key to the progress we've made. I used to sit in Bo’s stall for hours on end, trying to entice him with a bucket of A&M. Patience has paid off and we’ve developed quite a bond. It’s exciting to master little milestones and I’m looking forward to new ones.

This is from Wanda and her suggestion of making the motions with her hands prior to actually putting the halter on, has been dubbed "Wanda's Paradigm".

>>I made a mistake once this winter with Solon and worried him about halter training. Doesn't help when you have frozen fingers.

So we've been building from square one and using clicker training.

I found that he liked it when I made all the motions with my hands as though I actually had the halter in my hands. I broke the steps down into steps he could soak in and be comfortable with. I've been working on this off and on for a few minutes each day for the last week or so.

Tonight I actually managed to get the halter on his head AND fastened....and he stood like a little soldier.

The whole crux of the lesson was to just get him used to me working around him and to build his trust in me. He'll carry these lessons with him for the rest of his life.

When you look at it from a horse's point of view, I can't imagine how much trust it must take to have a human come up to you and wrap their arms around your neck and rub your poll, and then want to enclose your head in a halter. It amazes me that horses even let us get near them.

Wanda
loving it when babies learn...<<

OK, here's the link to specific pages at KBR (Kickin' Back Ranch) which deals with wild horses. Willis and Sharon are buddies of mine:

http://kbrhorse.net/pag/train.html

You might give him some goodies in a bucket near where you're sitting so that he can associate good things with being near you. Not necessarily grain, which he probably doesn't need, but maybe alfalfa / grass pellets with a chopped up carrot or apple mixed in.

What is his regular feed?

Get him used to being with you; let him get comfy and then try the "approach / retreat" method with touching him. You can find more about this on Willis' website:

http://kbrhorse.net

I'll try to find the exact link because there's TONS of pages on Willis' site. He explains how to use a pole to start touching the horse if he's too nervous to get close enough to you.

It works something like this: touch the horse with an extension of your arm (maybe a crop or a whip or a bamboo pole or broom handle) with something soft at the end (maybe a wadded up sock). If he won't jump away from you, try to drop a pellet or piece (small) of carrot into the bucket if he stands while you touch with the extension. Then walk away for a short period of time... to the corner of the corral or at least away from his "space". Try again. Let him know that you will leave if he lets you touch him AND he'll get a treat!

This will help him think of you differently and not like the guy who roped him for haltering.

Try it and let us know if you need more input. It's hard to describe in writing.

Judy,
That makes sense to me. Do you suggest that I feed him anything during this time--a carrot or something? He is (1) and hasn't been cut yet--is it important to take care of that asap? I will try what you suggested and let you know how it is going.

Hi Curtis, I wonder if you can do a few "unconventional" things. One would be to sit out there with him, read a book, or whatever, and just let him take his time to come to you. Let him smell you, and just hang out with you, without asking anything from him. You may have to do this for several days. BUT... if he does it on his own, it's a different paradigm than if we force him to come along with us. Does that make any sense?

As for the nipping, yes you can feel free to have him "accidently" run into your elbow or something. You have to be watchful, look for the signs (horses give several pre-cues before they do something). It takes someone who is able to notice these things ahead of time to help prevent them and extinquish the behavior.

There is no easy answer to horse training, but this is a good quote: "slower get you there faster" and Pamelia says: "we hurry horses slowly here".

Judy

Hi Judy,
Indy is very cautious around me and I have to trick him into letting me put the lead rope on him everyday. If I don't have food for him, I can't get the rope clipped to his halter. Once we are together for a while, he is very attentive and has been allowing me to touch him everywhere from the waist forward. After a while, I can even unclip the lead rope and walk about 10 feet away and he will come to me so that I can clip it on again. However, if more than a minute goes by without any contact, he reverts to his "skiddish" behavior and it is like I was never out there in the first place. Plus, he has been nipping at and biting my wife. If I don't get him under control sometime soon, she'll be breaking me. I am new at this so anyone please feel free to help me.

You would have to ask the halter question. The "gentlemen" that
haltered him roped him and pulled his head up through a gate and forced
one on him. They did it while I was at work thinking they were doing me
a favor. What a joke. It took me a week to get close to him again.
Now I am afraid to take it off fearing that I will never get it back on.
His demeanor is always very cautious at first. I feed him a can of
grain and when he is finished with that, I clip the lead rope on him and
lead him to the round pen. I lead him a few rounds and then halt him
and rub on him a little. We walk some more and repeat the process for
about 15 minutes. I have not been able to touch his butt or stomach
yet. Usually after a few minutes of leading him, he starts to invade my
space and actually pushes me. I stop and try to rub him and he begins
to nip at me. I read in one place that if they try to bite you that you
should give them 3 seconds of "hell" (try to kill them for 3 seconds).
Many sites said to kick them in the stomach, whip them, etc. Then, I
read something you or Parelli or someone said about the issue and I like
that much better. I just haven't had a chance to try it yet. That is
to just waive your elbow up and down. Do you have any suggestions for
that? I hope I am not bogging you down with too many of my problems,
but I really like this horse and I want to make some good progress with
him this spring.

Edited by author 04-09-2004 10:20 AM
Hi Curtis,

It may take him a while to decide that people are OK.

What is his demeanor like when you go to see him? Is he looking forward
to working with you, or is he hesitant? nervous? curious?

A horse (like people) has the ability to learn (and retain) when they
are relaxed. If he's not relaxed, he may not be learning anything yet.

Do you ever go and spend time with him, without asking anything of him?
For example, just going out, maybe sitting down and letting him smell
you? This might be a good way for you to get him to "want" to be with
you. That "want" is important.

After he gets to smell you for a while, or just look at you, "be" with
you, you can give him a carrot, get up and leave.

Ya know the old saying "leave 'em wanting more". Create the desire in
him to "want" you.

You might have to do this a few times to have him looking for you,
asking you to come and see him.

How is he to halter?

The "Craig" you see listed above is actually me. My name is Curtis and I go by Curtis. Anyway, I work at a bank 30 miles from my home, so I was gone all day the day my horse was wrestled into a halter. As far as inheriting the horse--when we moved into our home several months ago, the gentleman that was moving out gave us one of the several horses he had because he couldn't very easily transport all of them to his new home in Georgia.

>>I inherited my horse when I moved into our new home


How did you inherit your horse? Was it part of the house sell? >:}

>>I am in the process of gentling a 1 year old colt


work? is in what kind of work? raven >;]

I inherited my horse when I moved into our new home. He is
exactly one year old and has never been worked with. I spend time with
him just about every day, but it seems like I am not making a whole lot
of progress. He does allow me to lead him with a rope and he
understands the idea of pressure and release. However, it is as if I am
starting over every single day with the "friendly game". I try to be
very gentle and slow with touching him, but he still is very "jerky"
anytime I try to touch him. By the end of a session, I can touch him
all over his head, neck and part of his back, but the next day it's as
if were starting over. Is this normal? I want him to be a horse for
the kids to be around and ride, but right now he is a pain.

We have some pictures of young horses (around three and four years old)
being played with here: http://iceryder.net/sitemap.html

With the yearlings, we mostly do clicker training, taking them on walks,
hand-grazing, getting used to lifting feet, obstacles, etc.

What type of things are you doing so far?

I am in the process of gentling a 1 year old colt. Is it best to work with them on a full or empty stomach (the horse that is).

>>Kelly and Cindy and Raven, how are your rides going?


My rides are awesome! I love my new horse....been riding a ton of hours. Raven

Kelly and Cindy and Raven, how are your rides going? I'm really disappointed about Hlynur's feet. It seemed almost too easy for his re-training. I hope he's not in discomfort and that it's only a temporary thing.

Comparison pictures of him here:

http://iceryder.net/hlynurfeet.html

Dianna, so glad to hear about your successful trail ride. It HAS been a long haul for you and Bjarmi. It also sounds like you are happy now. Has it been worth it? Would you have changed anything?

Some new photos from today's training session:

http://iceryder.net/trainsession.html

>>http://www.triple-s-ranch.com/sale_horses.htm

Cindy...I don't think there any Icey in him, IMHO...he looks like a small RMH. Raven

Susan has the Wintec Wide saddle available:

http://www.saddleuptack.com/webcat/items/item1099.htm

No need to subscribe or register.

Did you see the new pictures?

http://iceryder.net/trainsunny5.html

Judy

OK I made it here. Do I have to register?

Here goes---I am one happy camper. It has been a long haul working towards this goal. Sheila my very patient friend with the quarter horse took us to the trail head and we were out in nature for about 3 hrs. It was so beautiful. Bjarmi was excellent. He would follow or lead. Payed attention to me. We trotted on the straight stretches. Both horses in halters. We tolted too for a bit while Stormy trotted along. There was a deer up ahead of us but neither horse cared. No spooks from either one about anything. I have been in seventh heaven for 24 hours and can't wait to go again. All the work was worth it and thanks for sticking by me.

>>Can we tell about our rides?<<

Sure, go for it!

What about this pony named Little Cesar. Could he be part icelandic? He's in the northwest where there's a high concentration of icelandics.

http://www.triple-s-ranch.com/sale_horses.htm

Hi all, I made it here. Found this nice pinto pony mare for sale http://www.lavellefarms.com/horsesforsale.html look down the list for Stormy.

I found it! Thanks! What things are going to be discussed here? Can we tell about our rides? Dianna

Let's try this message board to see how it works.