It is so interesting how Taylor's mom treated her like she is the most wonderful, smartest thing in the world and she could never do any wrong and Taylor loved it. Taylor treats Turtle the same way even though she doesn't know it, when Turtle says "bean" for the first time, Taylor says she is the smartest thing in the world. Taylor didn't think that until Turtle said the word. it's amazing what parenthood does to you.

Edited by author 03-29-2002 09:37 AM
I think it is somewhat interesting that most of the families portrayed in BEAN TREES consist of only two people. First Missy and her mother, then we have other families such as Taylor and Turtle, Angel and Lou Ann, etc. Even when Lou Ann becomes pregnant, Angel leaves so there once again is only two in her family. Also there is Estevan and Esperanza and even the two old women neighbors. Lou Ann does have a larger family when her mother and grandmother come for a little while but even that has a definite separation into two pairs. This book isn't just about defining families differently by the ways the members interact, but also by family structure.

I think the way Taylor's mom treated her is having a large effect on how Taylor is acting towards Turtle as well. I can't imagine if Taylor had grown up under different circumstances and if her mother was more negative towards her that she would have even taken Turtle in. However, I think readers can see stubborn, strong women emerge in Taylor when she is faced with confrontational characters such as the man at the abandoned gas station on her way to Arizona. In this situation we saw how she can stick up for herself and defend her inviduality.

Well, I thought I would comment on our discussion from yesterday. What stuck me about the portrayal of family in Family Ties is how we get such an incomplete view of it. For instance, it seemed like Michael J Fox is the comic of the family and it appears like that works for them. However, he never really listened to his family, his mother in particular, and just went directly to making jokes. Had that been a real family there probably would have been a lot more reaction to him because he is actually pretty inconsiderate and if someone in my family treated me like that, I know even if I ignored it at first, that frstration would build up. I also think the Steven seems all nice and supportive at first, but he too never really took the time to just listen to his wife, he just wanted to solve her problem as quickly as he could. We talked a little about the gender roles yesterday and I thought it was a little stereotypical how in the end, even though it is perfectly obvious that Elyse's work is just about as important as her family, Steven's words about how she has made her mark on the world through her kids are suppossed to be exactly what she needed to hear. That just didn't match up to me. I think if he had been the one feeling like his work, that he puts so much energy into, was being mistreated and abused, it would be harder to convince him that his family is all he needs.

Family Ties seems to me to be part of a dying breed of
"family television". I do not know of many television shows today, that depict the American Family in such an idealistic but not realistic way. The Keaton's are a picturesque family that many individuals hoped to achieve to. They were loving and helpful and almost too perfect. Of course like many other shows like "Full House", "Growing Pains", and "The Cosby Show", there is a lesson to be learned in every episode. However, I do not think there is anything wrong with that because these shows as well as many others were and are very entertaining.

In watching Family Ties yesterday and after our discussion in class I still believe that despite what t.v. shows us no one's family is that perfect nor are their problems solved in a half hour. I am not saying that there is anything wrong with shows with happy endings but I believe that they give a false impression of what the more realistic "American" family is. When I was little and even now I watch reruns of once popular shows such as the Cosby Show, Full House, and the Growing Pains. Each of these shows portrays what the supposed ideal family in America is. But I don't believe that there is an ideal "American" family. I believe that family is what you make it.
    In the book we are reading now, Taylor's family consists of her and her mom and of course now Turtle. Lou Ann only has her son Dwayne Ray because her husband is divorcing her. And even though Lou Ann's mom and grandmother come to visit for a time they leave so they are not really that close to her. None of these families are what we would call the supposed ideal "American" family.

I am replying to Ginger Zupancic's post. Many t.v. shows today are not centered around the "traditional" family, but there are some shows still out there that have that element to them. One great example is "The Simpsons." However zany and unrealistic the show plots may be, the show is still centered around a nuclear family. The Simpson family always sticks together no matter what, something very akin to other t.v. shows that our class has been discussing, like "Cosby," "Full House," or "Growing Pains." While it is a cartoon, "The Simpsons" still offers heart, whatever that may or may not be...

While watching Family Ties and reading The Bean Trees, I came to the conclusion that neither can be considered a normal family and furthermore, no family can be considered normal. Every family has its distinct quirks and or strange past, which makes it unique. These oddities, in many cases, act as a bonding compound, holding the family together through a common past and or characteristic that only they know of. For example, in Family Ties, the family comes together to help their overly sentimental mother get through the demolishing of her building. Most people would find that picketing the destruction in this situation would be way too extreme, but they acted as if these situations were a commonplace occurrence to their family. Also, in the book The Bean Trees, Taylor and the other characters form a family (even though they are not blood relatives) that would be considered very unusual to most people. Taylor and Turtle are brought much closer since they share the trials and tribulations of legally becoming a family. However, even though these may not be what some people believe as the “model” family, the love between them still exists and that is truly the only normal characteristic within any given family.

Edited by author 03-29-2002 11:34 AM
In response to Matt's comment that no family can be considered normal, I'd like to say that not only would I have to agree, but I'm not sure that I'd like to live in a world where everyone is considered a "normal" family. The reason why we are drawn to such sitcoms like Family Ties and The Cosby Show is because they are usually not achievable in our own family structures. We look to them, not always to see how our family should act, but to see how unique and special our own family units really are. I think as long as a family has love then they can survive just about anything. We read about families like Taylor and Turtle for entertainment, and yet they remind us not only of ourselves, but in many cases of people we know. Their courage gives us inspiration and looking at their family makes us appreciate our own even more.

With everyone discussing the comment of "a family being normal", it makes me think what everyone's definition of "normal" really is? Personally, I dont think a normal family consists of a dad that works, mom who is the house wife, a wonderful boy who plays baseball and talented daughter who is in ballet. That may have been what many families strived for YEARS AGO, but now? Shows such as Family Ties and The Cosby Show aren't shown anymore as often. Why? Because that isn't the ideal family anymore. Look at shows such as Gilmore Girls or Friends. Those are families, normal? Look around, and you will see more families consisting of a single parent with children more than you see the typical family of Family Ties. I think times have changed and defining of a normal family needs changed.

   One of the most important points made in class was the ideal family may have never excisted. Watching television growing up I would think the sitcom families had the greatest lives, and how easy life would be if it were more like thiers. The news paper, television news, and even my friends made me realize that sitcoms, such as Family Ties were quite unrealistic; I then began to think that disfunctional was somewhat normal as far as the family goes. Even if the ideal American family was working it, would become an issue of happieness. Sure it would look good and ideal, but would everyone be happy? In what was thought to be the perfect family, the husband would work, the wife would stay at home and clean the house and the children would do as the parents told them. One possible clue that unhappieness is evident in families is the rising divorce rate, an obvious result of unhappieness witnin a marriage or family. I believe there are no set standards for what a family should be. Every person or family has different issues and lives there life in different ways. As long as that person or family is satisfied, than the family is ideal.

I also think it is significant that almost all the family's in this book only involve 2 members. Taylor, from never having a father, has really built a unique level of independence. She remains callous to any attempt one makes to push her. This book has much to do with the portrayal of such families but I also feel that it is making a statement about the potential women have in regard to standing up for themself and clearing stereotypes. Taylor is in no way your typical woman. Again, I feel this has much to do with not having a father and having of mother with such a strong will, but it seems that Taylor doesn't even wait for a situation to come up. She attacks a potential aggressor before they have a chance to start something. Hell as a male I don't even have the power to do something like that!!! That's some balls right there! And a homosexual horse! HA! This book really provides some comic relief which has caused me to gravitate to it more than anything. I don't know if it is just because she is from Kentucky or what, but I've really been getting a kick out of some of her rules of thumb. They are all very obvious, but things that I've never considered before or had difficulty putting into words.

My family rarely has any problems or conflicts, it is scarry actually, my sister and i get along fine, and my parents have been married for 25 years. The one thing pretty much everyone regards my family is as the perfect situation. Already in class we have encountered some basic problems within the family, and we saw first hand some of the problems in our viewing a episode of family ties. I have had a hard time relating to this because the only time i have encountered divorce or a family problem has been with my friends while growing up. This is one thing in life i am actually not familiar with and have no idea about. I am also starting to become acquainted with these problems because or our novel, where they play a big part in the character development and plot. I hope by the end of this course i will have a better idea about what the normal family is all about because now i don't have the slightest idea, is mine normal? or is it just my imagination.

do anyone else thing that Bingo, the guy who sold vegetables to Lou Ann, is the smartest person in the book? I think he is very smart.

   The American Family... What does this even mean? There is no such thing. There is nothing but the ideas that we have been given through the media, through the government. We accept what we see before us in the media as truth when in fact it is nothing more than what those in positons of power tell us is right, typical. I think the very idea that the image we see before us on a screen is what our own lives, families should be like silly. We need to stop with the focus on what we think we should be like and accept the fact that the real true American family is one of diverse members and a variety of problems. In a way it seems that anymore dsyfunction is the norm.